If that were the case then the generic 12 gauge cable at 2.05 sq mm cross sectional area should outperform the QED Silver Anniversary which is a 1.5mm2 cable roughly equivalent to 15AWG, except it doesn't. So how do you explain that then?
Extending a speaker cable
- Thread starter HawkEye244
- Start date
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I think you should define "outperform". 
I don't doubt that objective measurements will quantify various aspects of the sound output. I can imagine graphical waveforms being provided for different cables, each having slightly different peaks and troughs at different frequencies and different amplitudes.
All very impressive and no doubt interesting but I still maintain that, unlike loudspeakers that DO differ in sound quality, subjective measurements of the sound quality of different cables might well be inconclusive.
Perhaps some people have rather better hearing than do I!
All very impressive and no doubt interesting but I still maintain that, unlike loudspeakers that DO differ in sound quality, subjective measurements of the sound quality of different cables might well be inconclusive.
Perhaps some people have rather better hearing than do I!
Valid point.I think you should define "outperform".
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I think your arguments are a bit muddled.
Some Hi-Fi hobbyists and manufacturers have held the view that speaker cables have a sound. That has been decried as a subjective view and most often attributed to placebo effect alone. The general accusation is that there's no objective measure to back up the subjective opinion. big-all's response is typical "you get an electrical impulse along a cable this impulse lacks any intelligence so send it by concord or public transport the end result will be almost exactly the same it gets from point "A" to "B" and providing its a reasonable job the coils on the speakers will recieve the pulses and the sound will be identical"
You yourself appeared to agree with DaveHerns when he made the point, albeit phrased differently, that £20 and 20p cable would be perform the same. However, when presented with the graphs that show cable do indeed alter the sound of a speaker you're now backtracking. You're saying you think that cables will produce different resulting graphs when measured. Is that it? How can it be both? You then make another oddly contradictory statement about "subjective measurements". How can measuring something be subjective? You go on to say that speakers differ in sound, and yes, I would agree. A frequency plot would show exactly that. So how come a frequency plot showing the difference between two speakers is valid, yet ones showing the effects of cables somehow aren't? How does that work?
Not muddled in the slightest.
I accept that different cables might result in different graphs, yet I maintain that there is unlikely to be any difference in the sound heard.
Different materials and different thicknesses will have different levels of resistance, but I doubt that this will make any appreciable difference to the sound heard UNLESS the cables are so thin that their resistance will prevent sufficient current to pass as was discussed earlier.
Not oddly contradictory in the slightest.
It is perfectly possible to make subjective measurements. Granted, they cannot be numerically quantified but a listener can describe what they hear in terms of quality, even if it's only "seven out of ten" for example. Such measurements are, of course, subjective. In other words, they are likely to vary between subjects.
ok my take on this
spend the £60 you save by not using overpriced cable on better quality headphones then there will possibly be an improvement that you will notice
we need to remember tests will held in clinical very stable laboratory style set ups often scewed to give favorable results for there product
in the real world the actual difference will not be noticed to any extent then decent headphone are the sensible choice
spend the £60 you save by not using overpriced cable on better quality headphones then there will possibly be an improvement that you will notice
we need to remember tests will held in clinical very stable laboratory style set ups often scewed to give favorable results for there product
in the real world the actual difference will not be noticed to any extent then decent headphone are the sensible choice
Actually, there's plenty of evidence, including quantum physics, to suggest that the entire universe comprises conscious energy. Therefore it's quite possible that an impulse has intelligence (and I defy anyone to prove otherwise).
(I thought that, as we're deviating from the original question, we might as well go all the way!)
So your argument is "Yes, there's a difference. But if I have cloth ears and can't hear it personally then it doesn't exist"..... and you don't see how that's muddled?
The fact very that something is subjective means it is an opinion. Counting the number of people who hold that opinion is an objective measure of the number of heads, that's all. The opinion itself remains subjective.
I can see what you're grasping at but you're barking up the wrong tree. You're trying to move the goalposts and change the game entirely.
If properly set up then lab measurements give two main benefits. They reduce the possibility of corruption to data sets by external factors e.g. measuring a speaker in an anechoic chamber minimises the effect of sound reflections that would be heard in a real room. Secondly, the methodology and results can be more rigorously inspected. If the results are skewed in favour of a product then the lab has failed in one or more counts. But that's different to how the results are interpreted.
to be honest theres only one "sweet spot" on a system so anywhere else is a compromise
iff its connected to a telly then its an even greater compromise with the owners the only sweet spot both for sound and screen positioning
iff its connected to a telly then its an even greater compromise with the owners the only sweet spot both for sound and screen positioning
You've been watching too much Doctor Who!
Perhaps I do have cloth ears. My assertion was that it does indeed exist but that most people, or possibly all people, can't hear it. I believe there are 'experts' who claim to hear an improvement in sound when expensive cables are used. Perhaps they have a financial interest in the marketing of such cables, or perhaps they are trying to impress people.
My advice is that if you personally believe that paying £200 for cables rather than a tenner produces a better sound, go for it. It's your money.
Isn't that what I just said?
We aren't talking about sweet spots and connecting to TVs. The proposition made by you and a couple of others is that as long as a cable can carry sufficient current then there's no difference in sound. I've just shown you that this isn't the case and pointed you towards graphs that clearly show a difference.
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