First fix plumbing question 2 - push button toilets

[ey143]

I've had very bad experience with previous push button toilets some 10 years ago where I got so fed up with the mechanism not working properly that I reverted to a handle based cistern.

We've got some 5 bathrooms to get ready for plumbing first fixing in a few weeks and I need to supply the parts for everything. What do people recommend in the following:

1. Wall mounted toilet frames i.e. floating toilets, which are the best frames to consider and which toilets are good (does the frame and toilet manufacturer have to be the same or is the frame universally standard?)

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

3. Are these fancy two button wall plate systems good - I mean how does a light push of a button activate a powerful flush compared to a handle, and which is better for old people usually?

4. Best place to get these bits online / offline?

5. Any other tips you recommend on the above?

 

[PullerGas]

Firstly, There's no such thing as a 'Builder', you may have a Main Contractor on your job, but you don't have a Builder. Your 'Builder' maybe a Brickie, Joiner etc etc but rarely is he a Plumber. Question on Plumbing should be addressed to, yes you've got it, the Plumber!! Questions on the wiring & electrics should be put to the Electrician. These & many other trades are Sub-Contractors of the Main Contractor, and their interpretation or quality of materials may be vastly lower than your expectations!!!

If you use a Main Contractor that says he does everything himself, sack him now!!! He's a cowboy!!
Ensure you have a Contract for the work, signed, sealed & delivered.

Now, A Plumber will answer your question;
WC frames are great, wall hung WCs are great. Just ensure ALL services are pressure tested before being boxed in, get signed certificates from the Main Contractor. McDee frames are good.

 

[dilalio]

1. Wall mounted toilet frames i.e. floating toilets, which are the best frames to consider and which toilets are good (does the frame and toilet manufacturer have to be the same or is the frame universally standard?)

Gerberit frames; Villeroy & Bosch or Duravit pans.

http://www.geberit.co.uk/en_uk/head_structure/download_center_2/download_center.jsp?q=&num=1000

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

Geberit cisterns are designed so that everything can be accessed via the push plate aperture.

Get them through your local bathroom centre or plumbing centre as there are many different model numbers and chances are you'll order the wrong ones online!

Work out if your installs are straight or bent pan connectors as these are bespoke to the frame and come in either variation!

 

[dilalio]

And yes... Pressure test your first fix and leave all pipework pressurised when other trades follow, so you'll know if some idiot tacker (usually a kid with no interest in what he's doing) goes through a pipe with a gyproc or whilst screwing down flooring!

He'll see a dark spot appear and you'll see a pressure drop on the gauge you have fitted to the end of run!

 

[PullerGas]

1. Wall mounted toilet frames i.e. floating toilets, which are the best frames to consider and which toilets are good (does the frame and toilet manufacturer have to be the same or is the frame universally standard?)

Gerberit frames; Villeroy & Bosch or Duravit pans.

http://www.geberit.co.uk/en_uk/head_structure/download_center_2/download_center.jsp?q=&num=1000

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

Geberit cisterns are designed so that everything can be accessed via the push plate aperture.

Get them through your local bathroom centre or plumbing centre as there are many different model numbers and chances are you'll order the wrong ones online!

Work out if your installs are straight or bent pan connectors as these are bespoke to the frame and come in either variation!

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.

 

[dilalio]

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

I've not had any problems with them down here, but I'll take note for next time I'm fitting one up Scotland way

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.

I wouldn't know. Have only ever fitted geberit, but it makes sense that all cisterns need to allow access.

 

[ey143]

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

I've not had any problems with them down here, but I'll take note for next time I'm fitting one up Scotland way

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.

I wouldn't know. Have only ever fitted geberit, but it makes sense that all cisterns need to allow access.

How do you pronounce gerberit, is it ger-ber-it? These frame was also suggested to me like ibox universal for the hansgrohe. Is gerberit universal for any floating toilets (is floating toilet the correct term?)

 

[ey143]

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.[/QUOTE]

I dont understand - why will soft water problems affect the valve washers, surely its hard water that damages things over time?

 

[dilalio]

How do you pronounce gerberit, is it ger-ber-it? These frame was also suggested to me like ibox universal for the hansgrohe. Is gerberit universal for any floating toilets (is floating toilet the correct term?)

Geberit (Jeb-er-it).
They should support ANY "wall hung pan", but you need to double check... Mounting methods are pants on some pans (I.e Vitra).

 

[muggles]

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.

Idont understand - why will soft water problems affect the valve washers, surely its hard water that damages things over time?

Some Geberit flush valve washers suffered from osmosis, which caused blisters to form in the washers over a period of several years. Five minute job to fix it with a replacement washer, and I believe the new ones use a different washer material

 

[PullerGas]

2. As the cistern will be boxed in and tiled, those face plates with 2 buttons, what happens if something leaks or does not flush, will we have to break the false wall and tiling to get to the tank. My builder says we just take off the silver face plate (two button) and that will be enough room to access the parts in the cistern for changing - is that true?

We've had flush valve washer problems with Geberit frames of late. Their crappy washers don't like our soft Scottish water.

All frames make it possible to access cistern parts via the flush plate.

I dont understand - why will soft water problems affect the valve washers, surely its hard water that damages things over time?[/QUOTE]

Soft water can be acidic mate & Gawd knows what Scottish Water put in it???!!!!

 

[ey143]

Whilst I hate the taste of anything non London Water, I always thought soft water was best for appliances etc.

 

[ey143]

There seems to be quite a few different geberit frames and valves etc.

What do you all regard as high end quality models for both?

And more importantly which models allow for easy diy replacement (for float/flapper valves) and maintenance.

 

[PullerGas]

Whilst I hate the taste of anything non London Water, I always thought soft water was best for appliances etc.

You're having a laff mate??!! You drink the water in London???!!!
Along with the warm pizz you call beer, the water has got to be the most disgusting liquid on the planet!!!