Fitting Hive to an Ideal Vogue Max Combi 32

[JacobSladder]

I have had a Hive SLR1c receiver, thermostat and hub sitting around for a year to replace the Honeywell set up I inherited when we moved in. When an Ideal engineer was here I asked him whether it was a difficult job to self install but was advised "Nah.....you just match the set-up you've got now - no need to touch the loop cable". Today I took the plunge and guess what - the boiler failed to power on when I wired up the Hive (Blue to Neutral, Brewn to Live, Black to (1), Grey to (3) and Earth to Earth). I attach a pic of my boiler wiring and feel that I should be connecting Brown and Black from the Receiver to the connections currently occupied by the loop. If not, where am I going wrong? I've attached pics of my boiler wiring which has mains feed from a fused socket via the left hand cable. The right hand one connects with receiver. The other pic is existing wiring for my Honeywell CM900 system. Thanks in advance

 

[CountryFan]

Grey and green/yellow (incorrect btw - which is why you thought it was earth/cpc)

It should be live and switched live (so 1 and 3) you need to place both brown and black in L and blue to N.

 

[JacobSladder]

Grey and green/yellow (incorrect btw - which is why you thought it was earth/cpc)

It should be live and switched live (so 1 and 3) you need to place both brown and black in L and blue to N.

Thank you, so just to be sure I understand the wiring in the Hive plate from L-R is;

N - Blue ; L - Brown and Black ; 1 - Grey; 2 - Blank; 3 - Green/Yellow 4 - Blank

Presumably I need to earth the plate with a separate Green/Yellow cable and need to mark the cable in 3 with brown or black tape (and at the boiler end too?). Other than that, the boiler wiring remains exactly as is.?

 

[CountryFan]

Thank you, so just to be sure I understand the wiring in the Hive plate from L-R is;

N - Blue ; L - Brown and Black ; 1 - Grey; 2 - Blank; 3 - Green/Yellow 4 - Blank

Yes, correct

Presumably I need to earth the plate with a separate Green/Yellow cable and need to mark the cable in 3 with brown or black tape (and at the boiler end too?). Other than that, the boiler wiring remains exactly as is.?

Doesn’t have to be earthed as class 2 equipment, but no harm in doing so. Yes would certainly mark it up. Or you could alter the wiring so it’s correct. Also, boiler needs to be checked for safety afterwards as it forms part of the combustion circuit

 

[ericmark]

Doesn’t have to be earthed as class 2 equipment,

That is not strictly correct, I agree the earth does not do anything, but the regulations state

A circuit protective conductor shall be run to and terminated at each point in wiring and at each accessory except a lampholder having no exposed-conductive-parts and suspended from such a point.

which is why the earth tether is provided, so it can comply.

I do find the backplate is open for errors, as so many ways to wire it. The answers given assumes one channel and not using the OpenTherm option. For that boiler, one could use OpenTherm, although I am not sure if it would really save much.

The idea is the boilers modulation is better controlled, every time the boiler is switched off, and back on again, it has to work out output required from scratch, so we want the boiler to run for as long as possible but with reduced output (modulated) so it can gain the latent heat, and if the boiler is controlled in the main by the TRV heads that will happen even without OpenTherm, but that assumes you are using linked TRV heads so the boiler does not turn off until all TRV's are satified.

I am not convinced that is the best option, as the boiler can modulate down to around 6 kW, but radiators are often smaller than 6 kW so the boiler still needs to use a mark/space switching, to get the output low enough, but it should at least when the boiler does the switching turn back on fully modulated.

However my boiler is not OpenTherm enabled so it does not matter for me, in fact it will not modulate, but yours will, I have not gone the Hive route, I went the Wiser route, same back plate, and with the Wiser think I can have upto 9 room thermostats, I think I made an error using a thermostat built into the TRV, as being low down, they triggure the boiler when the room is really warm enough, the stand alone thermostat being mounted higher, seems to better represent the general room temperture.

 

[JacobSladder]

Yes, correct

Doesn’t have to be earthed as class 2 equipment, but no harm in doing so. Yes would certainly mark it up. Or you could alter the wiring so it’s correct. Also, boiler needs to be checked for safety afterwards as it forms part of the combustion circuit

Thank you for your help and guidance - that has been really clear and useful.

 

[JacobSladder]

That is not strictly correct, I agree the earth does not do anything, but the regulations state which is why the earth tether is provided, so it can comply.

I do find the backplate is open for errors, as so many ways to wire it. The answers given assumes one channel and not using the OpenTherm option. For that boiler, one could use OpenTherm, although I am not sure if it would really save much.
View attachment 386921The idea is the boilers modulation is better controlled, every time the boiler is switched off, and back on again, it has to work out output required from scratch, so we want the boiler to run for as long as possible but with reduced output (modulated) so it can gain the latent heat, and if the boiler is controlled in the main by the TRV heads that will happen even without OpenTherm, but that assumes you are using linked TRV heads so the boiler does not turn off until all TRV's are satified.

I am not convinced that is the best option, as the boiler can modulate down to around 6 kW, but radiators are often smaller than 6 kW so the boiler still needs to use a mark/space switching, to get the output low enough, but it should at least when the boiler does the switching turn back on fully modulated.

However my boiler is not OpenTherm enabled so it does not matter for me, in fact it will not modulate, but yours will, I have not gone the Hive route, I went the Wiser route, same back plate, and with the Wiser think I can have upto 9 room thermostats, I think I made an error using a thermostat built into the TRV, as being low down, they triggure the boiler when the room is really warm enough, the stand alone thermostat being mounted higher, seems to better represent the general room temperture.

Thank you for adding some further clarity - much appreciated