Goodbye MG Rover

[2scoops0406]

Ok, but who's in business and who is not ??

 

[AdamW]

Ok, but who's in business and who is not ??

Oh, I totally agree with you. What I am saying is, when making their decision to close Rover they no doubt took into consideration the fact that the UK was one of the biggest buyers of BMWs, and that this could affect their sales.

Their decision paid off because Brits still buy Beemers.

 

[kendor]

I don't understand this reply at all kendor. The grace period you refer to is being blatantly ignored by some of the other memberstates.

The grace period doesn't seem to work concurrently rather each country seems to have a different complience date from when the rule was applied, i suppose this is to make it fair for those economies that can't initiate change as quickly as britain can , i quoted the wiring colour code change as an example of how britain has got away having to had to comply over 20 years ago, they negotiated to allow time otherwise the expense of change would have been enormous,
the other countries i presume have negotiated for time also on different issues but in the next 10 years or so they will not be allowed to buy their own vehicles to use your example.
You give the impression that britain is the only one having to comply but they fought tooth and nail to get europe to adopt the BS standard of colour codeing but lost out in my opinion, to an inferior codeing system, I suppose the majority system won in the end (bit like the argument over which side to drive with britain wanting left side but being in a minority on this) so we have to accept majority rule unfortunately.
i'm sure if the legislation wasn't so watertight that we would have got out of it somehow so if britain can't manage it what with her legal briefs then other countries will not escape.

 

[Freddie]

I personally think in one way this is a good thing, not only does it get rid of another filthy indudtry from the UK, but with the recent price rises in petrol that this will push the UK and other countries to look for other systems of transport, or that only the wealthy will be able to run around in cars, either way the car industry has run its couse in the UK and this is just another way to the end.

 

[david and julie]

You are missing the point here though. Let me use Germany as an example. I recently saw a news item on an issue in Germany, I can't remember what it was, but it is irrelevant to my point anyway. The German emergency service vehicles were all in a line and clearly visible. Fire engines were Mercedes trucks, Ambulances were Mercedes Sprinters and the police cars were all BMW's. Whenever there is an issue in France or Italy it is exactly the same thing, they use home grown products. All these countries are members and it is highly unlikely they have derogations to buy only homegrown vehicles. The way they do this is by wording the tender documents so only their own products fit the criteria. If I go back to Germany and use the BMW's as an example. The tender document would only have to say such as cars must be rear wheel drive. That one sentence, which is not against EU competition rules, would preclude almost every other car except BMW's, as most cars are now FWD. When need be they can be really specific with this backdoor buying of home produced goods.

The wiring example is not the best because there are training and safety implications. Whereas the police could perform most basic work in any type of car. A Vauxhall or a Rover would do the same job as a Fiat or Renault in Italy or France, but I doubt you would ever see them.

 

[david and julie]

I personally think in one way this is a good thing, not only does it get rid of another filthy indudtry from the UK, but with the recent price rises in petrol that this will push the UK and other countries to look for other systems of transport, or that only the wealthy will be able to run around in cars, either way the car industry has run its couse in the UK and this is just another way to the end.

Freddie I do not support the subsidising or granting of aid to Rover, but then I don't support subsidising any businesses at all. If nobody gets grants we are on a true level playing field which is fine. What I don't like though is that we couldn't do this, even if we wanted to, because the EU say we can't. Even though they give grant aid left right and centre for all manner of stupid ventures or schemes. Including the biggest of the lot CAP and even worse, property developers. Just look around how many developments have the EU flag outside them. All in the name of regeneration. There are waterside flats near me that cost £300K+ each that are getting regeneration grants.

This is subsidy to wealthy property companies under another name. We should have no grants of any sort to anybody, except possibly to charities and suchlike.

 

[AdamW]

France, but I doubt you would ever see them.

I looked up on "les gendarmes.com" and found this in their standard purchase tender:

"Le police car must have les stupid gadgets avec no point to them, e.g. l'automatic electric handbrake, les lights that switch on when you enter un tunnel, or un buzzer that goes off if you changez les lanes sans les indicateurs"

The 1980s version included "le stupid wafty suspension avec les hydro-pneumatics".

 

[AdamW]

I personally think in one way this is a good thing, not only does it get rid of another filthy indudtry from the UK,

Might help our Kyoto obligations somewhat... to be honest I hadn't thought of that.

 

[david and julie]

It would help the Kyoto agreement even more if we didn't have thousands bureacrats pushing paper about in air con or heated offices in Brussels or Strasbourg. Then travelling halfway round Europe by plane or WHY, to get home of a weekend.

It could be said Rovers failure may even contribute to pollution because the chances are the void will more than likely be filled by cars from abroad. These may well use exactly the same ammount of fuel, but the ship that brought them here used diesel, and therefore caused pollution. I find it ironic every week when the recycling people come to my house in a Mitsubishi truck from the far east, when we build trucks in Preston 30 miles away.

The whole EU idea is bad for the environment because it encourages massive centralised manufacturing plants, rather than producing locally where it is needed, some EU built products are needlessly travelling from one end of Europe to the other.

 

[Freddie]

Its the biggest farce going yet again more tax payers money wasted by Europe trying to find things to do.

Any saving in Europe will be dwarfed by China's growth, so basically it's completely pointless

 

[pipme]

...........Any saving in Europe will be dwarfed by China's growth, so basically it's completely pointless

But this is where our Govn's excel ... screw us down whilst others snigger and carry on regardless.
For example, the EU construction 'law' etc... Seen the stuff in Greece etc ? Do not tell me that lot is built 'up' to a standard ....

 

[pipme]

I wonder what happens regarding spares and warranties if manufacture ceases totally ?

I understand the parts & spares have to be available for the next 10 years.

I think it may be 7 yrs .... But who manufactures the bits in the event of shut down without takeover ? Who pays for the warranty work, supplies the bits etc ?
One could pretty soon own a car which cannot be driven ...

........... or that only the wealthy will be able to run around in cars, either way the car industry has run its couse in the UK and this is just another way to the end.

I think, when people begin to realise the effect upon their pocket and the infrastructure of the country .... the reality or not of the demise of the car is a major thing.
There would be enormous unrest about contributing to road upkeep for a perceived few.... Thereby, pretty soon the road system would fall into huge neglect as monetary savings pursued ... Just look at the current business of 'road blocking' by councils .... removing swathes of road from use -- to combat congestion.
Simple outlook is remove roads whilst increasing vehicle ownership = more jostling for less space = congestion ---- 3rd world scenario !!

Who in hell would want to own or drive a car with only a percentage of the current number of vehicles ? We can be, rightly or wrongly, a vindictive race especially concerning 'haves' and 'have nots', you'd never be able to park the thing .. who could afford the insurance ? The dream and the reality do not match up.

 

[Freddie]

I wonder what happens regarding spares and warranties if manufacture ceases totally ?

I understand the parts & spares have to be available for the next 10 years.

I think it may be 7 yrs .... But who manufactures the bits in the event of shut down without takeover ? Who pays for the warranty work, supplies the bits etc ?
One could pretty soon own a car which cannot be driven ...

........... or that only the wealthy will be able to run around in cars, either way the car industry has run its couse in the UK and this is just another way to the end.

I think, when people begin to realise the effect upon their pocket and the infrastructure of the country .... the reality or not of the demise of the car is a major thing.
There would be enormous unrest about contributing to road upkeep for a perceived few.... Thereby, pretty soon the road system would fall into huge neglect as monetary savings pursued ... Just look at the current business of 'road blocking' by councils .... removing swathes of road from use -- to combat congestion.
Simple outlook is remove roads whilst increasing vehicle ownership = more jostling for less space = congestion ---- 3rd world scenario !!

Who in hell would want to own or drive a car with only a percentage of the current number of vehicles ? We can be, rightly or wrongly, a vindictive race especially concerning 'haves' and 'have nots', you'd never be able to park the thing .. who could afford the insurance ? The dream and the reality do not match up.

No but one thing i have always believed will happen at the risk of sounding foolish is that the combustion engine or car is extremly inefficient so soon i think it will be pay as you go electric as most journeys are only short so todays battery powered cars could easily cope and most probably extremly safe driverless, just punch in destination and off you go, no jams, no accidents, no speeding.

Of course these things will only be lightweight and basic as the love of the vehicle will disapear.

This will mean the end of a lot of industry but will be cleaner and safer and is totally unobtainable by political means but could only happen by price rises in fuel to force the issue.

The beauty of it the fuel needed for the extra electricity can come from a number of sources instead of a dependancy on oil for petrol.

The only trouble is, any stupid country like Britain and the Labour goverments reliance of basing their economy on oil/petrol revenue runs into real problems, but i think there is a few years yet before the change to adjust.

 

[Scoby_Beasley]

My 1st car was an 1800, crap. further down the line came a maxi, not bad.A few years back (divorce settlement !!) I got lumbered with a 214sli which took me back and forth to work in Scotland from Brum nae bother for 2 years 'til the (Peugot) gearbox gave up the ghost.I then bought a 216gti ('95), still going strong, still like **** of a shovel, but it has got a Honda engine, but BMW stuffed that little co-alition.
If Rover goes you may as well shut Brum !! The knock on effect will be catastrophic..

 

[Freddie]