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Help! Double glazing manufacturer run-around?

Discussion in 'Windows and Doors' started by jchannon, 3 Apr 2019.

  1. jchannon

    jchannon

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    Hi all,

    We had some windows and doors fitted 6 months ago and have condensation ever since when there is a cold night. The walls were built during the hot summer we had last year so we don't believe there is any moisture in the bricks etc that need settling.

    The manufacturers have been very slow on trying to find a solution for us and we're at the end of our tether and not really sure what our next steps are.

    I've made a video to show the windows and doors to try and explain the situation.

    We'd be grateful if you could watch it and give us any questions or things to try or next steps to suggest to get this resolved.

    I don't really want to go down the legal route but it's been 6 months and we're nowhere close to a remedy so not sure if that's the last resort.

    Many thanks

     
  2. JohnD

    JohnD

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    You have condensation in your house due to humidity in your house. This is not caused by doors or windows.

    Common causes of excess humidity are:

    Wet washing draped over radiators and airers
    Effective extractor fan not being used enough in bathroom and kitchen
    Plumbing leaks
    Excessive breathing
    Building defects
    Insufficient ventilation to remove the water vapour that the occupants create

    The only way windows can contribute to steamy windows is if you don't open them enough.
     
  3. MR_W

    MR_W

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    It is not the windows or doors causing the problem.
    Having had condensation in the past, I would agree 100% with what JohnD said above.
    Do what he says and it should resolve the problem.

    You could also try using a dehumidifier which are availble second-hand for £50+.
    If you have window vents then use them or leave windows open slightly.

    I had a tenant complaining about condensation and gave them the same advice and it worked.

    Also remember that condensation will appear in the coldest part of a house or room.
     
  4. jchannon

    jchannon

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    Well the next step is the manufacturer is suggesting fitting trickle vents as they are not currently fitted to the doors.

    My confusion is that downstairs we have bi-fold doors and don't have the issue therefore my only guess is that during the night when we sleep our breathing is causing it. I've experimented with not using the bathroom etc to try and reduce possible moisture but no luck.
     
  5. JohnD

    JohnD

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    Water vapour is lighter than air so it moves up through the house.

    Do you mean that your bathroom does not have an effective extractor?
     
  6. jchannon

    jchannon

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    I'm not sure :)

    But as an experiment I tried not using the bathroom closest to the window so there is as little moisture as possible but in that experiment we've still woken up with condensation.
     
  7. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

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    That looks like alloy frame - are you sure the interior of the frame has been filled with insulation?

    Alloy is notorious for conducting cold
     
  8. jchannon

    jchannon

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    Hi Harry,

    It is aluminium.

    I don't think it has been filled with insulation.

    I know the areas that collect condensation have expanding foam below them because I saw them do it.
     
  9. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

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    I would expect the alloy box sections to be filled with insulation at the manufacturing stage, but I'm no expert - just using common sense.

    We used to have alloy frames, the early narrow uninsulated ones and they were terrible for collecting condensation on the frames.

    Perhaps someone in the trade could comment?
     
  10. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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    John_D and Mr W are spot on , i can't see that being an issue with the actual window frame or glass. New window frames will NEVER solve condensation. Condensation is caused by water vapour settling on colder surfaces as John _D says . If it wasn't settling there it would be the next coldest point in the room ( usually a wall behind a wardrobe or unit ). The average person emits an astonishing amount of water vapour whilst they are sleeping. I have in my head its a figure of around 2 ltrs ( per person! ). If you have the door to that room closed whilst asleep then that vapour has to settle somewhere, also its worth bearing in mind the warmer a room is the more moisture the air will hold before depositing it on the frame/glass. Trickle vents are very unlikely to solve the problem in honesty , they were designed to allow for ' background ventilation ' to prevent the build up of Carbon Monoxide gases originally. The frame itself does indeed look like Aluminium which is the coldest material that can be used on windows /doors hence you are seeing the condensation and without speaking to the manufacturers/suppliers no one will be able to ascertain whether they are ' foam ' filled . I suspect in this day and age that they are due to Windows and doors having to comply to ' U' values ( the lower the value the more energy efficient they are ) , but this would need confirming. I always explain the drawback of Aluminium when we fit it , as this is most certainly one of them.
    The most effective way of dealing with condensation is to locate the root cause ( be it showering / cooking / drying clothes or even just normal breathing, then warmth and ' purge ' ventilation should help. My gut feeling is you are never going to completely eliminate it all of the time
     
  11. jchannon

    jchannon

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    Hi Ronnie,

    I can certainly ask the manufacturer to see if they are insulated. I'm assuming you're in the business so can tell you the manufacturer privately to see if you might know.

    It certainly seems that showering and breathing maybe the culprit here and I guess explains why the aluminium bifold doors downstairs don't get condensation overnight because no one is in that room.

    Trickle vents might help a little bit though?

    The confusing part is if the warmer a room the more moisture the air will hold but your last comment about warmth and purge seems to be the opposite? Do you mean add warmth?

    Thanks
     
  12. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

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    One litre per day through respiration and perspiration combined is a generally accepted loss figure, plus 1.2 litres through urination.
     
  13. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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  14. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

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    I am a little surprised that if the alloy frame is insulated, that moisture condenses on it, but yet not on the glass of the windows. It does rather suggest that there is no insulation within the frame and cold from outside is being conducted through - That the alloy is conducting much more cold through, than the window glass.
     
  15. Notch7

    Notch7

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    I think the problem is that it is difficult to make an aly frame profile with a thermal break that is strong enough yet also restricts the conductivity of heat.
     
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