Help needed re: changes to switch operations.

[dannit]

HI, To put you in the picture I originally had a set up as follows:

Stairway Lighting
Downstairs switch = Triple switch (one operates the downstairs hall, one operates the upstairs hall linked 2-way to downstairs hall and one operates the external porch).
Upstairs switch = Single switch (operates the upstairs hallway only).
I then added a single switch to the equation to the far end of the upstairs hallway so this has now become a 3-way operation.

From the triple switch at the base of the stairs I now try to relocate the downstairs hall switch and the external porch to over by street door as it's much more convenient this way. These will be put in a double socket.
In doing all this I now turn the switch at the base of the stairs into a single that operates only the upstairs hall light.
Now it gets tricky (at least it does for me)
I find that the downstairs hall and outside porch are run from the same live because when one is turned off the other is turned on and vice versa. So I now need to add a new switch line to work the porch light but that'll have to wait til the weekend so I have time to lift the floorboards etc.
I continue on and relocate the downstairs hallway light to by the street door and disconnect the porch completely just to keep everything safe.
The downstairs hall is operating fine and dandy.

I attach a photo - can someone confirm I'm on the right track please.

Under Floor Boards in Bedroom

• dannit
• 14 May 2009
• 1

For piece of mind it would help if you could confirm the positioning (if you are able to do that from a picture) for the new switch line so I know I'm not nuts in my belief.

Now I want to add a single switch at the far end of my downstairs hallway and link it as a 2-way to one of the switch points on the double switch at my street door. This is the one that I'm mulling over because I've never added a 2-way to a double socket before (I've only ever done 2-way single to single operations to date so this is a challenge). I stopped at a local DIY store yesterday but there wasn't much to choose from and I couldn't see any double switches with 3 gang operations so I assume I double the wires to the terminals at the 1st switch at the street door along with the far end of the hallway in order to keep the 2nd switch at the street door free to use for the porch??

Can anyone help on this please?
Danni

 

[EdwardCurrent]

Hello.

The 'joint box' in the picture is not suitable to be left under your floorboards.

Have a look in the wiki, there are plenty of lighting 'circuit' diagrams there that should help you.

Ed

 

[dannit]

Thanks Ed, but that worries me as I've lifted quite a few floor boards in my house (I'm in the middle of an extension) and there are lots of these dotted all over the place! Should I have them all replaced? and if so, what's best to use?

ps. there are no circuit diagrams in the Wiki showing a double switch to a single switch operating as a 2-way or am I missing something?

 

[EdwardCurrent]

Hello Danni

'Screwed' connections can loosen over time.
How about these ?
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ803.html



Ed

 

[holmslaw]

..

 

[dannit]

Ed, thanks for the time and effort spent finding these - I'll certainly change over to them for the project I'm working on. I'll worry about the rest as I go along.

Danni

 

[dannit]

Thanks Holmslaw - I knew I'd open a can of worms showing that photo!

 

[Space cat]

I find that the downstairs hall and outside porch are run from the same live because when one is turned off the other is turned on and vice versa.

You have mis-wired the double switch. I take it that the three core cable marked "switch line" goes to that switch. Start by joining the two L1's with a short, red link wire. Now put the red wire from your cable into an L1 and the blue and yellow wires into the two COM's. You should now have two switches that work correctly.

If they are the wrong way round, swap the blue and yellow wires over. If one of the two switches works upside down, move the red wire(s) from its L1 to L2 IN THE SAME SWITCH.

Your second problem is not so simple but it can be done - and this is why you've got a red wire in L1 (or L2) already. Take the non-red wire out of COM on the hall switch and move it to the empty terminal ON THAT SWITCH. Now connect the three terminals of this switch through 3-core cable to matching terminals on the remote switch. That will give you the two-way switching you want.

 

[dannit]

Hi Space Cat,

No the switch line in the photo goes to the downstairs hallway not the porch - there doesn't seem to be one for the porch.

There were only ever 2 cables going to the triple switch. Leaving one in place for the upstairs hall means I have one cable working both the downstairs hall and the outside porch - there was a small black piece of wired cable jumpered across to act as a switch line. But now I've repositioned I obviously can't jumper it across again. So I will put in a switch line for the porch and I think that will work.

The downstairs hall issue: I have a double switch by the door. Only one switch is wired at the moment this is to the downstairs hallway. The second switch on that double socket will eventually become the porch. But how do I connect another switch at the other end of the hallway and link as a 2-way to the switch that is wired on the double switch now ie. so the hallway works at both ends? Sorry if I'm not clear - I wish I could speak verbally it's difficult to put into a short sentence!

Danni

 

[dannit]

What I have at the double switch in the hall is shown in my attempt at drawing a picture.

Double switch

• dannit
• 14 May 2009
• 1

I then need to add a single switch at other end of hallway working as a 2-way to the first switch on the double socket in the picture.

 

[dannit]

Oops! Space cat I just re-read your reply and I think I get you now. Sorry! I will check it out when I get home this evening. Fingers crossed it'll be exactly how you say.

Thanks again, Danni

 

[ban-all-sheds]

.
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//www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting
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.

 

[dannit]

.
.
//www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting
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.
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But those drawings only show single switches linked to 2-way, I needed advice for the double to single. Thanks for the advice though.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It doesn't make any difference.

1-gang, 2-gang, 3-gang or 10000000000000000000000000000000-gang, it's just 1, 2, 3 or 10000000000000000000000000000000 totally electrically separate switches sharing a faceplate.

 

[dannit]

Oh I see. Doh!

Thanks Ban-All-Sheds