Insulating a single brick porch

[dave2506]

Hope one of you knowledgable guys on here can help me. The previous owners of our house built a small porch on to the front of the house to extend the small downstairs hallway. The porch itself is roughly 2x1m and there is no door between it and the downstairs hall (previous front door has been taken out).

The porch is making the downstairs of the house extremely cold due to it only being made of a single layer of bricks and having no insultation to speak of whatsoever. There isn't even any plasterboard on the brick, just some textured compound that has been painted over.

I soon want to begin work to rectify this problem and want to know what the best course of action would be to insulate the porch to make the house warmer and eliminate the build up of condensation on the exterior walls of the porch which is encouraging mould growth.

Would it just be a case of putting up a polythene membrane over the walls, then battening and fitting foil backed plasterboard with some other insulation (rockwool for example) in between the batterns. Then sealing the plasterboard prior to plastering or are there additional things I should be doing?

There are also several holes drilled in the mortar that go through to the outside - these are covered with ventilation plates on the inside. Will I need to keep these (obviously doing them in a more aesthetically pleasing way) or can I do away with them altogether?

Many thanks in advance for your help - I should be able to post photos up if it helps at all.

 

[planemad]

You could build a stud wall and pack with rockwall.
Or

Dot and Dab Thermaline insulated plasterboard to the wall and re plaster to a good finish.

Or

You could actually do both rockwall inside stud wall with thermaline then screwed to the studs.

Don't use the foil backed board it will be useless, thermaline has an inch or so of foam stuck to the back of it.

http://www.british-gypsum.com/produ...roc_thermal/gyproc_thermaline_plus.aspx[list]

 

[Chukka63]

tank the walls,screws battens onto wall.insulate between battens and board,leave a small gap between floor and p,board.thats the most economical way,space wise.

 

[Richard C]

The others have posted some suggestions to improve insulation but

The porch itself is roughly 2x1m and there is no door between it and the downstairs hall (previous front door has been taken out).

Just like to advise you that’s actually in breach of Building Regulations.
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/england/public/buildingwork/projects/workcommonporch A porch is only Building Regulations exempt if an external grade door is retained between it & the rest of the property. If the door is removed, the whole of the porch construction must comply with Building Regs.

Don’t know when you bought the house & why it wasn’t picked up by the surveyor, perhaps it was a while back but be aware it would be unlikely to go unnoticed on a present day sale.

 

[dave2506]

The others have posted some suggestions to improve insulation but

The porch itself is roughly 2x1m and there is no door between it and the downstairs hall (previous front door has been taken out).

Just like to advise you that’s actually in breach of Building Regulations.
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/england/public/buildingwork/projects/workcommonporch A porch is only Building Regulations exempt if an external grade door is retained between it & the rest of the property. If the door is removed, the whole of the porch construction must comply with Building Regs.

Don’t know when you bought the house & why it wasn’t picked up by the surveyor, perhaps it was a while back but be aware it would be unlikely to go unnoticed on a present day sale.

Thank you for letting me know. That's rather alarming as the house was bought in July last year and it didn't come up in the survey.

If we fully insulate it as we are planning to do, would that bring it in line with the building regs? The other solution would obviously be to fit an external grade door between the porch and hallway as must have originally been there prior to construction. Please note however that when I say porch, I don't mean the sort of building that has brick up to a certain height and then glass etc up to the top. It is solely brick built with a small window facing to the front of the house. Don't know if this will make a difference but thought it was worth mentioning.

 

[Richard C]

Once you remove the external door between the 2, it's no longer B. Regs. exempt, folks often do it, although I often don’t understand why; it then also becomes unauthorised building works. The same applies to Conservatories & neither usually has any thermal insulation to speak of, that’s the whole point of the regulations. Depending on how it’s constructed, it may be possible to bring a porch up to spec (it’s impossible with a cons) but single skin brick walls will require somewhat more than a bit of timber battening, some insulation & a standard wallboard facing to meet current insulation standards let alone the damp problems it can cause if not done correctly. It could prove costly depending on what else is involved & it may be easier just to reinstate an external grade door between the two.

How does the porch fit to the rest of the house, is it built onto the front of the house with its own roof? What sort of roof does it have? Or is it constructed under a partially enclosed entrance?

 

[dave2506]

It's built on to the front of the house with it's own roof (I will need to investigate into the ceiling void to see if there's any insulation up there but I'm betting there isn't. The roof itself it pitched and slate tiled, and drains via its own guttering. I am unsure when exactly it was constructed - I don't know if perhaps the same building regs would have applied when it was built?

Would a product with a higher insulating value such as the plasterboard you can buy with foam backing (I think it's called thermaline but I'm not sure) be more appropriate for the job? Therefore create a cavity by building a stud wall and ensure it is ventilated, then fix the thermaline to the stud wall. In addition, insulate the stud wall with rockwool for example.

I'm aware the cheapest, and probably easiest, way out would be to reinstate the old front door but I would like to avoid it if at all possible as it warrants the porch area effectively useless to us.

Many thanks for your continued help - I'll put some photos up and that should help in terms of me having to describe its construction, location etc.

 

[Richard C]

Yes you can do that & insulate the roof to current standards but it will no longer be a porch, it will be classed as an extension; don’t know but this may also open a “Planning” can of worms. To make it “legal”, your going to have to submit a Building Notice (fee involved), advise Building Control how you propose to meet the regulations & they will want to inspect the work as it progresses. Although it may comply with the Regs. after you do the work, if you don’t submit a Building Notice you will still have the problem as you won’t have any paperwork certifying it as compliant; it will still be classed as unauthorised Building Works.

I would suggest you talk to your local Building Control dept. tell them what your proposing to do & they should offer advise on the best way forward for you.

 

[dave2506]

Having spoken to our neighbours who have been in the property for 50+ years, I have been told that the porch has been there for 20 odd years but I have no idea whether they would have applied for planning permission - apparently our neighbour's porch was built by the same person but they have retained their original front door and hence it is technically a porch!

Would I not also have a reason to go back to the surveyors and enquire why this was not flagged up on our survey? We paid for the mid level survey and surely they should have had a duty of care?

Edit: I've done a bit of digging around and it would appear that the porch would not need planning permission due its size and location and would normally be exempt from building regulations approval if the old door remained. As it is, it looks like I will need to apply for building regulations approval and get them to inspect and then sign off the work when completed.

 

[Richard C]

Would I not also have a reason to go back to the surveyors and enquire why this was not flagged up on our survey? We paid for the mid level survey and surely they should have had a duty of care?

If it was a “drive by” valuation survey commissioned by your lender then all they are really concerned with is that they can get their money back if they have to sell it from under you. Since the credit crunch & all the fuss about global warming, however, lenders are paying a lot more attention to detail such as unauthorised building works & even though yours is minor, it affects its instant salability. I would expect this would almost certainly be picked up under the energy assessment thingy now done as part of HIPS which changed & was given a few more teeth in April this year. If you paid for a full survey or even a house buyers survey you could go back to them & point out the predicament your now it, you may at least get a partial refund as I did for my surveyors failure to notice my current property had a blocked sewer!

I've done a bit of digging around and it would appear that the porch would not need planning permission due its size and location and would normally be exempt from building regulations approval if the old door remained.

Correct. But if you remove the door, it’s no longer a porch &, technically, becomes an extension. Now a porch doesn’t need PP as long as it meets certain criteria but extensions to the front of the property (even if they fall within your personal development rights) are very strictly controlled & you might well need PP; imagine a slightly silly situation where your allowed the porch (with the door fitted) but not an extension (with the door removed), even though they will look exactly the same; if you get my drift! This is something I’m not sure about & you need to get some guidance from your local planning office or you could end up in a bit of a pickle with it.

As it is, it looks like I will need to apply for building regulations approval and get them to inspect and then sign off the work when completed.

That’s correct but you will have to pay a fee, they will probably want to know in advance what your proposing to ensure compliance with current regs & may want to inspect work as it progresses otherwise they will have no way of knowing you’ve actually done what you said you would by way of insulation for instance.

 

[dave2506]

I did indeed pay for a house buyers survey as the property is 1930s and we wanted to know everything that might be at fault internally. For example, they pointed out the old consumer unit which we have now replaced.

I will contact the surveyors and our local planning office. Many thanks for your help with this.

 

[Richard C]

If you decide to leave the door off, bring it up to full spec. & go down the Building Submission route, I would be very interested to hear what, if any, issues it raises with local planning with regard to what I said about it effectively becoming an extension. Whatever way you chose to go, good luck with it.