Kitchen Re-wire

[scottishlad]

Hi there what it is is im am re-wiring my kitchen.
I was wondering if it would be ok to just put a 6mm radial in for all my appliance's.....dishwasher/washing machine/fridge/freezer/double oven(fitted with a factory 13amp plug). Coming of the fcus with 4mm to un-switched sockets?

I don't want to use the ring as i av a lot of extras going in like microwave/kettle/tv/George foreman etc and there has been other sockets spurred of the(30amp) ring main in the living room so i don't want to overload it.

Theres plenty spares on the board as i just fitted a new one.

I also want to fit a outside light will i run in a new cable from the board
Can i run the cable in 2.5mm t&e to a fused spur then take it outside with fp?

cheers

murray

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Hi there what it is is im am re-wiring my kitchen.
I was wondering if it would be ok to just put a 6mm radial in for all my appliance's.....dishwasher/washing machine/fridge/freezer/double oven(fitted with a factory 13amp plug).

Good luck looping 6mm² from one accessory to the next!

Coming of the fcus with 4mm to un-switched sockets?

Why on earth do you think you want 4mm² for a 13A circuit?

I don't want to use the ring as i av a lot of extras going in like microwave/kettle/tv/George foreman etc and there has been other sockets spurred of the(30amp) ring main in the living room so i don't want to overload it.

Then put a separate ring into the kitchen as well...

Theres plenty spares on the board as i just fitted a new one.

Did you test & certify it?

I also want to fit a outside light will i run in a new cable from the board
Can i run the cable in 2.5mm t&e to a fused spur then take it outside with fp?

Depends on the rating of the breaker.

 

[scottishlad]

Hi there what it is is im am re-wiring my kitchen.
I was wondering if it would be ok to just put a 6mm radial in for all my appliance's.....dishwasher/washing machine/fridge/freezer/double oven(fitted with a factory 13amp plug).

Good luck looping 6mm² from one accessory to the next!

Coming of the fcus with 4mm to un-switched sockets?

Why on earth do you think you want 4mm² for a 13A circuit?

I don't want to use the ring as i av a lot of extras going in like microwave/kettle/tv/George foreman etc and there has been other sockets spurred of the(30amp) ring main in the living room so i don't want to overload it.

Then put a separate ring into the kitchen as well...

Theres plenty spares on the board as i just fitted a new one.

Did you test & certify it?

I also want to fit a outside light will i run in a new cable from the board
Can i run the cable in 2.5mm t&e to a fused spur then take it outside with fp?

Depends on the rating of the breaker.

Ok it would be easy for me to go from appliance to appliance in 6mm not a problem i will have to make a calculation to see if i can do it in 4mm.
Ok i would use 2.5mm from fcu to un-switched socket.
Somebody told me they were phasing ring mains out and using radials (is this mince).
.out of interest how many people get new boards they have fitted there selves certified? Just cost a bomb.
I will put the outside light on a 6 amp breaker.


Your advice is appreciated.

 

[comms]

scottishlad wrote:
Hi there what it is is im am re-wiring my kitchen.
I was wondering if it would be ok to just put a 6mm radial in for all my appliance's.....dishwasher/washing machine/fridge/freezer/double oven(fitted with a factory 13amp plug).

Good luck looping 6mm² from one accessory to the next!

Ban's right why 6mm, use 4mm if you dont want a ring final (could even use 2.5 on a 20amp mcb

Coming of the fcus with 4mm to un-switched sockets?

Why on earth do you think you want 4mm² for a 13A circuit?

use 4mm or 2.5mm

I also want to fit a outside light will i run in a new cable from the board
Can i run the cable in 2.5mm t&e to a fused spur then take it outside with fp?

Depends on the rating of the breaker.

So long as the mcb isnt rated above 20amp. why use fp?

 

[scottishlad]

Just with it being outside thought fp would be better than t&e

 

[comms]

i will have to make a calculation to see if i can do it in 4mm

unless your kitchen is the size of windsor great park, youll have no problem with a 4mm radiak in a domestic kitchen

Somebody told me they were phasing ring mains out and using radials (is this mince).

the only place i've seen anything about this is on forums, load of cobblars..................untill the 18th edition comes out anyway

out of interest how many people get new boards they have fitted there selves certified? Just cost a bomb.

best take cover B A S will be sure to point you in the right direction.
Untested could mean unsafe & as for costing a bomb £300 - 400 is a fair price for my skills & knowledge thank you very much.

 

[scottishlad]

i will have to make a calculation to see if i can do it in 4mm

unless your kitchen is the size of windsor great park, youll have no problem with a 4mm radiak in a domestic kitchen

Somebody told me they were phasing ring mains out and using radials (is this mince).

the only place i've seen anything about this is on forums, load of cobblars..................untill the 18th edition comes out anyway

out of interest how many people get new boards they have fitted there selves certified? Just cost a bomb.

best take cover B A S will be sure to point you in the right direction.
Untested could mean unsafe & as for costing a bomb £300 - 400 is a fair price for my skills & knowledge thank you very much.

Fair play but all that is on the new board is 2x 30amp rings 2 x 6amp light rings 1 x combi boiler 6amp. all mcbs.
It was a pretty straight forward swap.
Cost me about £60

[/img]

 

[dannyboi2003]

Fair play but all that is on the new board is 2x 30amp rings 2 x 6amp light rings 1 x combi boiler 6amp. all mcbs.
It was a pretty straight forward swap.
Cost me about £60

[/img]

Oh dear, not an RCD in sight

 

[scottishlad]

Fair play but all that is on the new board is 2x 30amp rings 2 x 6amp light rings 1 x combi boiler 6amp. all mcbs.
It was a pretty straight forward swap.
Cost me about £60

[/img]

Oh dear, not an RCD in sight

If you had seen what was there before

Anyway for the budget i had it does the job for now next year i will get a split rcd board.

It doesn't have to be rcd anyway does it?

 

[scottishlad]

Look i came on here for advice what the feck is it with the criticism fair play if its constructive i will listen but if ur just having a pop like old danny gay boy there feck right off.

Or is this a place for the almighty sparks to tut and turn there nose up at us wanna be sparks(NOT) to make there selfs feel good.(i dont think it is)lol

 

[baldelectrician]

Hello scottishlad

Just a few lines from a bald scot;
Its a Wylex consumer unit ( ), not my prefernce, but not too $hit.
The consumer unit you have is NOT covered by an RCD.

All sockets liable to power sockets outdoors (usually deemed as downstairs sockets) require RCD protection.

I know you came here for advice, but it sounds as if you are making something that is straight forward complicated

When doing this type of work I would :
Replace consumer unit with a split RCD consumer unit (RCD both sides)
Add new ring circuit for kitchen 13A appliances
Add new cooker circuits as necessary (if electric oven & electric hob)

You need to bond your water and gas pipe work (Main bonding)
(legal stuff below)

You should use a competent person for the work, links below

In Scotland:
Individuals regitered;
http://www.sbsa.gov.uk/register/ListAC.asp
Companies
http://www.sbsa.gov.uk/register/SearchCo.asp?T=Construction&ID=2

As you live in a civlilsed part of the UK you need to be aware of a the Scottish version of the HIP- coming to a house near you on 1st December.

Home Reports (in Scotland) Govt press release
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2008/01/30105839/Q/Video/437

Home Reports (in Scotland) Website
http://www.homereportscotland.gov.uk/


You will be asked if there has been any work done, and if the surveyor notices any alterations he may ask for paperwork for gas and electrical works done. YOU will then have to pay to have work checked.

Or you may sell the house and nobody notices anything.
I have read the statement you sign (declaring whether or not certain works have been done) forms pert of the house contract with the purchaser.

 

[comms]

Look i came on here for advice

& I think you'll find thats what I gave along with the reasoning for the cost of a cu change.

• A few more helpfull tips for you:
  are the eqipotential bonds in place & correctly sized?
  supplimentary bonding in place?
  I assume you have used srcd's or that you live on the 3rd floor of a block of flats because as said there's no rcd.
  The ring mains are infact a continious ring main with no breaks or bridges.
  Lighting, well that wont be a ring..............unless done by an incompetant diyer.
  And of course you'll know you have a good earth path, because you'll have tested continuity / Ze & Zs.
  You'll have changed those 16mm tails for 25mm because the service cutout is rated at 100amp (not always required).
  Then the main eath conductor will have been upgraded from 6mm or 10mm to 16mm wont it (again not always required).
  A circuit schedule will be left with the cu wont it.
  There wont be any faults on the circuits because you'll have found them when testing & rectified all the faults.

Now I'm not having a POP as you say, but what I am saying is yes the board change only cost you £60 & was easy due to so few circuits, but is it safe & that my little sweaty sock you will not know because you haven't TESTED the work or know what is involved do you.

Now dont ever darken this place with such words as

Or is this a place for the almighty sparks to tut and turn there nose up at us wanna be sparks(NOT) to make there selfs feel good.(i dont think it is)lol

because I'd guess most of us sparks here spend all day working then rightly or wrongly give free advice to the likes of you.
aft

I thank you !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[scottishlad]

Look i came on here for advice

& I think you'll find thats what I gave along with the reasoning for the cost of a cu change.

• A few more helpfull tips for you:
  are the eqipotential bonds in place & correctly sized?
  supplimentary bonding in place?
  I assume you have used srcd's or that you live on the 3rd floor of a block of flats because as said there's no rcd.
  The ring mains are infact a continious ring main with no breaks or bridges.
  Lighting, well that wont be a ring..............unless done by an incompetant diyer.
  And of course you'll know you have a good earth path, because you'll have tested continuity / Ze & Zs.
  You'll have changed those 16mm tails for 25mm because the service cutout is rated at 100amp (not always required).
  Then the main eath conductor will have been upgraded from 6mm or 10mm to 16mm wont it (again not always required).
  A circuit schedule will be left with the cu wont it.
  There wont be any faults on the circuits because you'll have found them when testing & rectified all the faults.

Now I'm not having a POP as you say, but what I am saying is yes the board change only cost you £60 & was easy due to so few circuits, but is it safe & that my little sweaty sock you will not know because you haven't TESTED the work or know what is involved do you.

Now dont ever darken this place with such words as

Or is this a place for the almighty sparks to tut and turn there nose up at us wanna be sparks(NOT) to make there selfs feel good.(i dont think it is)lol

because I'd guess most of us sparks here spend all day working then rightly or wrongly give free advice to the likes of you.
aft

I thank you !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for you replie but cmon how many sparks go through the motions like that i mean cmon be totally honest now!

I was implying about what gaydar dan was commenting on the tit he is.

Lets not all get caught up in regulations here eh cmon chief srcd etc it just sounds like your trying to get one up maybe i done the work before these regs were brought in.

I do however appreciate your advice.

 

[Steve]

RCDs have been required on sockets liable to provide power outdoors for years. Its not a new reg. The 17th edition of the regs out later this year contains material that sways towards RCD protection for ALL circuits.

Your board looks very new, yet I cannot see any labelling on it. There is no provision for RCD protection (a lifesaving feature), none of the circuits have been tested, I bet you dont know what type of earth connection you have. You have no idea of the integrity of the circuits being supplied.

I am NOT an electrician, so dont shout me down for having a go. The average DIYer simply does not know what goes into a consumer unit change. Its not like changing a lightswitch.

If your house burns down due to an electrical fault, without certificates for the install, you'll be snookered.

However, there is one thing you can do to make it safer for about £40 - replace that main switch with an RCD. But beware, some of your old circuits may not like it - RCDs are very sensitive compared to fuses and MCBs. And the install still needs a PIR at the very least.

 

[scottishlad]

RCDs have been required on sockets liable to provide power outdoors for years. Its not a new reg. The 17th edition of the regs out later this year contains material that sways towards RCD protection for ALL circuits.

Your board looks very new, yet I cannot see any labelling on it. There is no provision for RCD protection (a lifesaving feature), none of the circuits have been tested, I bet you dont know what type of earth connection you have. You have no idea of the integrity of the circuits being supplied.

I am NOT an electrician, so dont shout me down for having a go. The average DIYer simply does not know what goes into a consumer unit change. Its not like changing a lightswitch.


If your house burns down due to an electrical fault, without certificates for the install, you'll be snookered.

However, there is one thing you can do to make it safer for about £40 - replace that main switch with an RCD. But beware, some of your old circuits may not like it - RCDs are very sensitive compared to fuses and MCBs. And the install still needs a PIR at the very least.

Well all i have tested is continuity and resistance of each circuit everything is hunky Dorey.
So there will be absolutely hundreds of thousands of houses without rcd protection in the uk.
What do you mean the integrity of the circuits being supplied? Ive checked them they are all fine!
Im sure my earth set-up is a TN-C-S system and i will be bonding the gas and water pipes when i have finished my kitchen.
Yes i am above average diyer thanks very much.Im a Refrigeration & Air con engineer,all electrical jobs aren't rocket science its just the know the correct procedures cable sizes etc REGULATIONS lol.
Yes rcds are very sensitive if you have earth leakage which i don't.

It ain't hard its just knowing how hence i ask for advice on here.
What im looking for is for someone to say this is the correct way to do it son not sum jobsworth thats been house bashng for 13 quid a hr all his life, and start picking me up on the most petty of points to make him look good.Thats not what this forum should be about.

Edit = Aye ma boards spanking new i coudnt afford a split board at this time so i bought that one its a dam site safer than the old one.Im very sorry its not marked up but its my feckin house and no other person will be touching it.I will mark it when i get round to it infact i might go and do it now just to make u the non-spark happy lol .