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Labgear "Sky+" installation

Discussion in 'Audio Visual' started by lavinpj1, 4 Nov 2015.

  1. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    Having recently cabled the house, I put in the necessary wiring (3 bits of coax to the living room) for a Sky+ install... in case I ever wanted it. I have a Labgear LDU608G distributor connected into a Labgear PSW351T. There's 2 LNB feeds and a UHF feed connected into the distributor.

    However... I cannot receive any freeview on a TV connected into the PSW351T. Facts below:

    • I have removed the PSW351T and installed a standard coax module, and then moved the downlink cable to a standard output... this works. I can receive freeview on the affected TV
    • All the other TVs in the house connected to standard outputs on the distributor work fine
    • The "Sat/UHF&CCTV" switch makes no difference to the PSW351T connected TV but setting it to "Sat" makes all other TVs in the house lose signal
    • I have no idea of the quality/state of the dish/LNB. Is it a requirement that the LNB works for the PSW351T to do freeview?
    Any other thoughts on the problem?
     
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  3. Lucid

    Lucid

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    Thoughts:

    1) Products such as the LDU608G with integrated satellite distribution overcomplicate home distribution. They give the impression that satellite can be distributed and used in the same was as Freeview. That's misleading

    2) Freeview should work regardless of whether the LNB(s) are working or not. The qualifier here though is that Freeview requires a working TV aerial. LNBs on a satellite dish don't provide a Freeview signal


    Downlink and Uplink is a loop-through connection. If you aren't sending the TV aerial signal down to a recorder box with RF In and RF Out sockets in order to piggyback the analogue RF signal on top of the TV aerial signal (e.g. adding Sky RF2 and distributing that to other TVs in the house) then the simplest option is to use a short link cable [connect Down Link directly to Up Link] and set the switch to UHF&CCTV. Connect the PSW351T wall plate(s) to any of the Out 1~8 sockets. This will give you signals from any roof aerial you have connected (TV/FM/DAB) on to all TV outputs.
     
  4. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    Thanks, Lucid. Are you saying that without a box with RF In and RF Out the PSW351T won't work when connected directly to the "Down Link"?

    I'll give it a go on a standard output socket.

    If I did, in the future, want to hook up a Freesat box what would be the wiring configuration for that? Would it need an RF out?
     
  5. Lucid

    Lucid

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    The issue isn't (or shouldn't be) the PSW351T. It is a simple diplex-type socket with a couple of extra direct connections (Sat1 and Return), that all. The issue (if you can call it that) is the way the 608 designed to accommodate something that is becoming a rarer feature, and that is an RF out which adds the recorder box signal on to the Freeview signal as it passes through the recorder.

    There's a growing discontinuity between what the 608 is designed for and what is provided with TV recorders. Freeview recorders rarely have a full RF Out function any more. What's there now is most likely a simple pass-thru arrangement that allows the Freeview signal to go through the recorder and then pass on up to the TV so it can be used independently. The days where you could watch the recorded output of a Freeview recorder on an RF channel tuned on the TV are dwindling if not already gone. So the idea of sending an aerial signal out of the 608 via Downlink Out, down to the recorder, and then picking that back up via the Return socket on the wall plate and then sending it back up another cable to the Uplink In socket on the 608 really makes no sense. The aerial signal is travelling a long distance for no purpose, and along the way it is losing signal quality due to the increase in noise. That's not the same as saying you can't use the Downlink/Uplink sockets right now because you certainly can.

    Downlink Out / Uplink In makes sense if you'll be using a Sky box. The feature still exists to play back or to view the Sky box output via analogue RF. There's a couple of caveats of course: (1) The other TVs in the house must have analogue tuners. That's also a feature being quietly dropped as manufacturers cut corners. (2) You need either the older version of the Sky box with RF2 out, or an I/O Link with built-in modulator with the newer Sky boxes. Providing both those conditions are met then the 608 makes a bit more sense. The signal paths are still a bit noisier though than direct connections.

    Freesat boxes: My guess is that there'll be no RF sockets for an aerial signal at all on a Freesat recorder. If you want to watch and control a Freesayt recorder from another TV in the house then you'll need something along the lines of a Triax Tri-Link kit (LINK, then scroll down). These are compatible with Sky magic eyes to provide control from other areas of the RF network.

    For anything that does use the RF out to add a recorder's signal to the distribution system then the wiring is Downlink Out to the PSW351T diplex input. Then from that wall plate's RETURN socket connect a coax lead up to the Uplink In socket. If you're running a twin tuner satellite recorder [Sky HD box, Freesat twin tuner box] then also connect a coax from LNB1 Out on the 608 to the appropriate RF SAT socket on the 351T. That will provide both LNB feeds to the Freesat recorder. Remember though, you shouldn't run more than one twin tuner Freesat or Sky box HD off the 608. LNB signals are actively controlled. Running two boxes carries the risk of conflicting instructions and service loss.
     
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  6. Sam Gangee

    Sam Gangee

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    In other words, to get Freeview to other TVs you must connect "TV" to "Return" on the PSW351T wall plate - either with a short cable fitted with TV plugs OR via a Triax Tri-Link kit connected to a Freesat satellite TV receiver. See LINK above.

    (For those readers with a Sky Digibox that has no RF outputs, you'll need a Triax IO-Link instead.)
     
  7. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    Understand what you're saying but Freeview already works on the other TVs. It's the TV that is connected to the PSW351T wall plate that does not receive Freeview
     
  8. Lucid

    Lucid

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    Go back to first principles: Check the wiring. Read the instructions.

    If the signal is getting down that cable to the TV without the 351 on the end, but when it's added then there's no signal then it can be only one of three things:-
    (a) it isn't wired correctly i.e. screen wire touching central conductor or the cable is in the wrong connection hole
    (b) your TV's coax lead is connected to the Radio or Return socket rather than the TV socket
    (c) the wall plate is faulty.
    I can't rule out this last one but I'd check very carefully on (a) and (b) first, then double check and triple check
     
  9. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    All 3 have been checked.

    (a) I have checked continuity on the distributor side between centre and outer of the F type. There is none suggesting it's not shorted. I will try it with only the quadplex wired in to see if it's the sat feed or return causing it. Possible?
    (b) Double checked this - it's definitely in TV
    (c) This was my first assumption. I wired in a plate about 9 months ago which also didn't work. I removed it and put a standard coax on instead. Since then, I misplaced the plate so bought another one. I suppose it's possible that 2 plates are faulty?
     
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  11. Lucid

    Lucid

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    It's always possible that both are faulty so I wouldn't rule out anything, but the chances are extremely low.
     
  12. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    If I connect the TV to the "Return" socket on the PSW351T, it gets a good signal. I thought I must have cabled it wrong, despite having tested it many times. I tested it again and the wire that connects to the Return on the PSW351T is the wire that comes from the "Up Link In" socket on the distributor.

    To be triple sure, I swapped around the "Up Link In" and "Down Link Out" wires on the distributor. Weirdly, the TV continued to work in the "Return" socket on the PSW351T.

    I really have no idea what's going on here... Broken distributor perhaps?
     
  13. Lucid

    Lucid

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    Let me get this straight........ You've got the downlead coax cable from the loftbox going in to the socket marked Return on the PSW351T? Furthermore, you have the other end of the same lead connected to either Downlink Out or Downlink In.......... Is that correct?

    Have you made any other connections to the 351T plate? If so, please detail in to which sockets and from where.
     
  14. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    It's cabled exactly as per the attached instructions. 3 bits of coax run from the distributor to the plate:
    • Distributor "Down Link Out" connects to plate "combined" input
    • Distributor "LNB 1 Out" connects to plate "sat" input
    • Distributor "Up Link In" connects to plate "return"
    The switch on the distributor is set to UHF&CCTV.

    If I connect a TV to plate "Return", it gets signal. If I connect TV to plate "TV", it does not.

    If I crazily reverse the cabling so it looks like this:
    • Distributor "Down Link Out" connects to plate "return" input
    • Distributor "LNB 1 Out" connects to plate "sat" input
    • Distributor "Up Link In" connects to plate "combined"
    Result is the same: If I connect a TV to plate "Return", it gets signal. If I connect TV to plate "TV", it does not.

    I've checked the wiring a whole lot of times. It's definitely 100% as per the first set of bullets above.
     

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  15. Lucid

    Lucid

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    Right, but have you connected the RF out from some "under the telly RF source device" to the RF Return? In other words, your connections from the wall plate to the pile of gear on the TV stand should look like this....


    Wall plate RF OUT to TV recorder RF IN

    TV Recorder RF OUT to wall plate RETURN
     
  16. lavinpj1

    lavinpj1

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    There's no other equipment there at the moment. Simply the TV connecting into the wall plate.

    If the TV connects to the plate "TV", it gets no signal. If the TV connects to the plate "Return", it does.
     
  17. Lucid

    Lucid

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    Right, so although you've followed the wiring instructions for the 608 and 351 the circuit isn't complete because it isn't being used as designed.It goes back to what I said in the very first reply to your query....

    The circuit is broken because there's no connection through a recorder's RF IN and RF Out. I can't open your pdf link for some reason, but every set of instructions I have seen or read for this type of Labgear distribution amp shows the TV and recorder equipment connected too. It forms and integral part of the circuit. So by the sounds of it you followed part of the instructions, but not all. I think that's really an important bit that was missed.
     
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