Leak from copper pipe in downstairs bathroom, thoughts on how to trace it?

[LenBeach]

I live in a 9 year old 3 story house with a bathroom on each floor, each on top of the other.

Recently I noticed water marks and mould on the wall behind the sink in the downstairs toilet. I crossed my fingers and hoped it was condensation on the pipes causing a bit of damp on the wall but after cleaning up the mould, it quickly returned.

I’ve investigated further tonight and removed the sink and pedestal and found a dicky tap tail. I’ve replaced the tap with a Grohe unit which I thought has solved the issue.

However there’s still a leak and on tracing back and breaking away some of the damp plaster, it’s actually running down the cold feed pipe from above inside the wall, hitting an elbow and then seeping into the wall.

I’ve just discovered this but am at a bit of a loss as to how to trace the leak. Do I start lifting floor boards in the middle bathroom and see if I can trace any issues at that level? I’d rather avoid aimlessly hacking into walls if I can help it.

The picture shows the pipe that it’s running down now exposed.

Thanks in advance.

 

[terryplumb]

How much water ,is it a constant stream ,the odd drip, or moisture all over ? Can't tell from pic ,the pipe looks dry !!

 

[CBW]

If they’re actually bathrooms, could you remove the bath panel? Also easiest way to check is visual inspection on visual pipes

 

[LenBeach]

The middle floor is a toilet with a sink directly above this one. The pipes to the sink on the middle floor are accessible behind the pedestal but they’re dry.

I do seem to recall when I changed a tap in the middle toilet that the pipes under the floor boards appeared to be copper pipes into push fit unions. I’m starting to wonder if one of these has failed.

 

[LenBeach]

How much water ,is it a constant stream ,the odd drip, or moisture all over ? Can't tell from pic ,the pipe looks dry !!

When the tap isn’t on, it’s a very slow drip. When the tap is on it’s a slow but steady drip down the pipe, every 5-10 seconds there’ll be a drop run down the pipe.

The pipe was filthy but I’ve cleaned it up to try and trace the leak as I initially thought the solder on the elbow had failed.

 

[terryplumb]

Do you mean the water comes from above ( down the vertical bit of pipe) ,at a different rate ,when the tap in downstairs bathroom is running ????

 

[LenBeach]

Do you mean the water comes from above ( down the vertical bit of pipe) ,at a different rate ,when the tap in downstairs bathroom is running ????

Exactly that buddy. There’s a slight drip with the tap off and from what I can tell, the rate increases with the tap on.

 

[terryplumb]

That's odd . If the water is coming down the vertical pipe you will need to do some invasive investigating higher up.

 

[LenBeach]

That's odd . If the water is coming down the vertical pipe you will need to do some invasive investigating higher up.

Thanks. I thought the same. I’ll do some more tests to be absolutely sure it’s running down the pipe then start upstairs. Fun times ahead!

 

[terryplumb]

Thanks. I thought the same. I’ll do some more tests to be absolutely sure it’s running down the pipe then start upstairs. Fun times ahead!

Happy Hunting ,good luck. Do keep us informed.

 

[LenBeach]

A quick update. So last night I found that one of the tap tails had failed, I then found that one of the unions had a leak where a plumber had tee’d off for outside taps.

This morning I’ve checked again, the taps haven’t been run, the only thing I’ve used is the shower on the top floor. The walk is soaked and there is water dripping off of the pipe so there’s definitely a leak further up.

 

[terryplumb]

Is the shower 2 floors higher up ,and vertically in line with the wall in your pic ? If so is there no sign of water on the intermediate floor levels ?

 

[LenBeach]

Is the shower 2 floors higher up ,and vertically in line with the wall in your pic ? If so is there no sign of water on the intermediate floor levels ?

The shower is behind me when I’m taking the picture and waste pipe in boxing to the right.

It’s 2 sinks directly above on each floor. There’s no signs of leakage anywhere and the only tell tale was this damp on the wall behind the pedestal.

I’m thinking that if there are push fittings below the sink on the middle floor, that one of these has failed. I’m having a look at my home emergency wording to see what options I have as the leak is worse than I thought.

 

[LenBeach]

Hi all. An update on this. It actually turned out to be 4 issues albeit 1/2 were the major issue(s).

The tap tails had failed inside the taps so were weeping, this happened on the other taps of this type in the house so I’m not surprised. The compression joints fitted when the outside taps were fitted to tee off were also weeping.

Frustratingly, when the plumber fitted the outside taps, he’d not correctly refitted the sink waste pipe into the soil pipe so it was partly draining into the wall cavity. Alongside this, the main issue was a push fit joint halfway up the wall from plastic to copper (why join halfway up a wall?!) had failed causing the bulk of the leak.

I’ve now got driers in and am expecting trades in after Christmas to rectify the damage. Thanks for everyone’s help and guidance with this.

 

[terryplumb]

Ok ,not much gone wrong there then Len. !!!!!!
Thanks for letting us know ,glad your sorted ( well kind of nearly sorted).
Hope your insurance is coughing up most of the costs involved.