New Rewire Cost of Sign Off.

[gibson8206]

We have had a complete rewire done to our recently moved in to 1967 house.
This is a 4 bedroom detached.
The total rewire including 4 TV points, 3 smoke alarms, kitchen heat alarm and external light came to £3,900.
This included all the sockets, light fittings and points, etc.
I have this evening received a call from the sparks who did the work informing me that the "Sign off" paper work will cost me £200 cash. I was expecting a nominal of amount of cash to achieve this.
Obviously need this certificate if we need to sell on, but cant help feeling I'm being ripped off! I believe its Part P authorisation by a qualified electrician.
Any comments or advice appreciated'

Best wishes from,

Gibson8206.

 

[hairyben]

Was this discussed at quotation stage, or something you brought up during the course of the works?

Personally, in this day and age in light of part P I think any serious contractor should include notification and certification as part of the works.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Did his quote itemise this as a separately chargeable item? BS 7671 requires him to issue a certificate, they aren't an optional extra, so he shouldn't be charging it separately.

Was he registered? If so, then make a complaint to his scheme. I know that many electricians don't hand over the certificates until they've been paid, and I can sympathise with them wanting some kind of lever to make sure they are paid, but NICEIC for example are quite firm on the fact that certificates are not to be withheld as part of a payment dispute, and from your POV the rewire has not been satisfactorily completed until the certificate has been issued, so he's asking you to pay before he's finished.

If he's not registered then you've got more than just this final payment to worry about. "I believe its Part P authorisation by a qualified electrician." makes me think that he isn't registered (is he even qualified?), in which case the grim news for you is that he broke the law, he should have notified the council in advance, and there is now no way that someone else can legally certify the work he did as compliant with the Building Regulations.

Now - that doesn't mean you won't get such a certificate, there are criminals out there, but if he and his fellow conspirator(s) ever get caught then your "certificate" may turn out to be worthless.

You need to find out his registration status, and if he's pulling a fast one you need to let Building Control and Trading Standards know.

 

[sparkyspike]

Have you asked what the payment was for? Inspection and testing is part of the job and is usually included in the quote, unless otherwise agreed. Maybe he is charging for an hour at a computer to print the certificate. If he is charging you for notification to building control, then be aware that this costs a registered electrician just a few quid. At the end of the day, it's what you agreed at the start of the job that matters. Don't pay any more money for the bit of paper!

 

[gibson8206]

Thanks for the replies Sparkyspike, ban-all-sheds and hairyben. Paid weekly in cash only. The job was completed some 6 weeks ago. Time taken about 12 working days.
Been waiting for the sign off since then and thought it would be about an extra £30.
£200 cash seems well over the top.
The electrician who did the job was recommended by a "friend". We live in Hertfordshire, he comes from Powys, Wales so its not like its just round the corner.
Relatives in Wales are waiting to settle this final bit on our behalf. Awkward situation, but judging from your replies been well and truly ripped off

Best wishes from,

Gibson8206.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Seriously - don't pay a penny more until you've found out the situation regarding his registered status and Building Regs certification.

 

[Pensdown]

BAS is right, don't pay until you've established if he is registered with one of the self certification bodies.

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

If he's not registered and the works were not supervised by a person/company that is, he has committed an offence by not notifying BC before he started the work. I would remind him of this and also explain that it would be in his best interest to get the works signed off at his expense before you take the matter further with BC and trading standards.

I would also talk the matter over with your friend who recommended him.

 

[TopTrumper]

He is Welsh, so just dont pay him anyway...

 

[ban-all-sheds]

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

And that fee is how much for a registered person?

If he's not registered and the works were not supervised by a person/company that is, he has committed an offence by not notifying BC before he started the work. I would remind him of this and also explain that it would be in his best interest to get the works signed off at his expense before you take the matter further with BC and trading standards.

And if you really want to twist the knife you could suggest that you're minded to discuss his cash-in-hand activities with HMRC...

 

[Pensdown]

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

And that fee is how much for a registered person?

As you know it actually cost us just over a pound to register a Part P job. However, there are companies out there that charge a hell of a lot more.

But I think in this case the installer intends paying a third party registered spark to sign it off, hence the 200 quid.

I would shop both of them

 

[hairyben]

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

wtf? If he registered with a scheme he has no choice but certify and notify the work. It's not an "optional extra", it's conditions of membership!

 

[Pensdown]

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

wtf? If he registered with a scheme he has no choice but certify and notify the work. It's not an "optional extra", it's conditions of membership!

....that's correct.

In this case it's probably hypothetical because I'm sure the £200 is for paying his mate to test and certify but what if he is registered? What's to stop him charging what he thinks fit for testing and submission? As it was a cash job he could argue that all payments up to now have been for the work and the extra £ 200 is for testing etc?

 

[hairyben]

If it turns out that he is registered (sounds unlikely) then you will have to eat humble pie and pay him because you did not agree the Part P notification fee before instructing him to proceed with the works.

wtf? If he registered with a scheme he has no choice but certify and notify the work. It's not an "optional extra", it's conditions of membership!

....that's correct.

In this case it's probably hypothetical because I'm sure the £200 is for paying his mate to test and certify but what if he is registered? What's to stop him charging what he thinks fit for testing and submission? As it was a cash job he could argue that all payments up to now have been for the work and the extra £ 200 is for testing etc?

I don't follow you. As a scheme member he's obligated to certify and notify. If he wants to charge £200 over the quote for doing that it's between him and customer, but it's doesn't affect his obligation to issue the cert.

there's been a lot said on here regarding homeowners vs. contractors and duty of compliance with part P, the way I see it is that as someone providing a "professional service" to an un-knowledgeable customer you have a duty to either self-cert or inform them to contact building control and the implications therein. IME courts of law agree with me.

 

[Pensdown]

If he wants to charge £200 over the quote for doing that it's between him and customer, but it's doesn't affect his obligation to issue the cert.

But in this case he can't issue the cert because the customer has not agreed his additional daywork charge for testing. No testing no certs, no certs no submission.

Although this is all hypothetical, if he was to argue that the cash he has received is for works to date there is very little anyone can do if he wants more to return and test it.

If he is registered he's got poor Gibson8206 over a barrel. No one can force him to go back and in his eyes, work for nothing.

 

[hairyben]

If he wants to charge £200 over the quote for doing that it's between him and customer, but it's doesn't affect his obligation to issue the cert.

But in this case he can't issue the cert because the customer has not agreed his additional daywork charge for testing. No testing no certs, no certs no submission.

Although this is all hypothetical, if he was to argue that the cash he has received is for works to date there is very little anyone can do if he wants more to return and test it.

If he is registered he's got poor Gibson8206 over a barrel. No one can force him to go back and work for nothing.

Does anyone have a house rewired on dayrate? Evan if so, the "electrician" should have still tested each circuit as he energised it, both to prove it's safe & ready and because it's the most efficient way... so in effect all he has to do is fill out the certificate, 15 minutes if you include a 10 minute tea break?