Nice pictures of nasty CU

[Dartlec]

Knowing how much you all like pics, I thought these might interest you.

Doing a PIR for a flat prior to council renting.

This is what I found:

The first thought was, accessible live parts, no CU cover so fail.

Then I climbed the ladder (Part M anyone) and found the rest.

Hmm, breakers look ok, but what's that on the left.

Oh dear....

OH DEAR

ARGGGGHHHHHHH (sound of feet running into distance)

It would appear that some wassock added an 8.5kw shower at some point (just over 35A) on a standard 30A fuse. I imagine it was glowing for some time before it decided to melt through the fuse holder, the fuse itself, and presumably the front of the Consumer Unit hence its absence.

Some not so bright spark then bypassed the fuse entirely by wiring the 6mm phase directly to the remaining lower prong of the half melted fuse and forcing it back in.

Fortunately the actual wiring in the flat was undamaged, and tested fine, so I will be sticking in a cheap 4 or 6 way unit to get it to comply.

This is an upstairs flat with no garden, so is unlikely to be used for portable equipment outdoors - would the experts on here recommend I put in an RCD incomer to cover all ways, or just go with a standard isolator? I have heard that councils are rather hung up on RCDs, even when they aren't necessary. Given the fuse board is at the top of the wall in the stairwell, maybe 8 feet off the ground, nuisance tripping of the rcd really WOULD be nuisance, but there are not really enough ways (or space) to justify a split load board.


Gavin

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Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change.

 

[plugwash]

I would ask the council whether they want the minimum to bring it to being just about compliant or whether they have any additional requirements.

IMO the CU and meter should really be moved to a more sane location.

 

[kkynaston]

Where is the service head?
How are you going to kill the supply?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It would appear that some wassock added an 8.5kw shower at some point (just over 35A) on a standard 30A fuse. I imagine it was glowing for some time before it decided to melt through the fuse holder, the fuse itself, and presumably the front of the Consumer Unit hence its absence.

Must have been more to it than that - surely a 30A 3036 will pass 35A indefinitely, without even breaking into a sweat?

 

[dannyboi2003]

Nice

The incoming supply looks a bit amateur but as theres a meter on the end of it have the DNO adopted it or does the meter belong to the council with the DNO meter supplying the building and a submain to the flat?

I think fitting a CU without any form of RCD protection would be daft, personally i would like to see RCD protection on the socket circuits (second floor flat or not) and more importantly the shower too! I would fit a small CU with RCBO's for the shower and socket circuits.

If the council are worried about the cost and not willing to at least add RCD protection then walk away as they obviously have their priorities very wrong.

All the best
Dan

 

[Adam_151]

That supply cable, I expect the DNO requested it be installed by electricial contractors when the building was put up, they then come along and install their service in the basement and a meter in the flat, so the cable is actually owned by the owner of the building, but its DNO side, which I gather causes much confusion over responsibilities should it ever become damaged!

I wouldn't have a shower not on RCD, are you sure theres not room for a split load board? (there looks it), and I'm not sure it'll push the cost up too much tbh?, I would put socket outlets on RCD side as well

Is it possible to drop the board down 3 foot or so, DIN rail terminals up there, trunking, longer tails from the meter and another bit of trunking? Possibly put the lighting on a C6 if the Zs complies, stop failed lamps taking out the breaker quite as often


As to isolation, perhaps the caretaker has a key to a room in the basement where all the service heads are installed (you'd have to get the DNO out to pull the fuse though!)... some however would chop the seal off the meter and drop the tails out with a VDE approved screwdriver... neither the metering company nor the HSE are likely to approve of that though!!

 

[bongos]

So if the service head/main isolator is in the basement and covers several flats then how do you replace the CU and tails? Sounds risky

 

[Lectrician]

Risky? Ehh?

If it is privately metered(doesn't look like it it), there will either be a single panel board or several switch fuses from a busbar at the origin. These would be the point of isolation for the flat.

If it is DNO metered, then you usually have a Ryfield board or similar at the origin with a 60 or 80 amp fuse per flat. If the DNO are fitting meters into the flats (which is rare - they usually locate them all at the origin), then they usually fit a second service head in the flat. Either way, there is a point of isolation, albeit a DNO one (as in a typical house).

Risky? Not really.







That metering does look odd though. Does not look like a DNO install, but looks like a DNO meter.


As for RCD's on a second floor flat. You cannot go around saying "I would like to see". We work to regs, are expected to work to regs, and are paid by customers (council inc) to work to the regs. If an RCD is not required, you shouldnt be saying "but I think there should be on". IT's like taking your car for a new tyre and the bloke saying "I would fit 4 the same make if I where you, and better have a new exhaust while your here......oh, and you don't have any car mats, we will put some of those in too."

with the 17th ed take.........

 

[Dartlec]

Its a single top floor flat above a greengrocer's, owned by the shop, but he is looking now to rent it to tenants via the council rather than private tenants (I don't know the exact details).

The supply is fed from the shop - I wasn't able to see the service head, because it was under a pile of vegetables but I will of course find out when I return to replace the board.

The meter is an EDF branded key meter, so I can only assume it was installed by them, though hopefully the CU was not in that state when they did so!

Gavin

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Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change.