No hot water upstairs

[ThaiStyle]

We have an Ideal Isar HE24 combi boiler (in our kitchen). Hot water downstairs is fine as is central heating (downstairs and upstairs).

However, we don't seem to be getting any decent hot water upstairs. Hot water tap in bathroom is 'warm' at best. Showers are warm for a bit and then end up luke warm or cold. Baths are also luke warm or cold - despite waiting for 5mins for hot water to arrive out of the tap.

British Gas have already replaced the heat sensor in the boiler but this has not helped.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what the problem might be?

 

[gigz]

With the heating off, turn any hot tap on and feel the left hand 22mm copper pipe under the boiler, is this pipe heating up ?

 

[ThaiStyle]

With the heating off, turn any hot tap on and feel the left hand 22mm copper pipe under the boiler, is this pipe heating up ?

I'll try that but can you explain what this will prove and why this problem only affects upstairs hot water?

 

[Agile]

I'll try that but can you explain what this will prove and why this problem only affects upstairs hot water?

I always expect those asking for help to carry out any tests which we suggest without expecting to be taught how to become boiler engineers.

The boiler does not know where its hot water is going. Either the flow rate is higher or there is a cold water crossover occuring upstairs because a mixer or joystick control has been fitted without a non return valve.

Tony

 

[ThaiStyle]

I'll try that but can you explain what this will prove and why this problem only affects upstairs hot water?

I always expect those asking for help to carry out any tests which we suggest without expecting to be taught how to become boiler engineers.

The boiler does not know where its hot water is going. Either the flow rate is higher or there is a cold water crossover occuring upstairs because a mixer or joystick control has been fitted without a non return valve.

Tony

I wasn't expecting to be taught how to become a boiler engineer. I was just asking for a brief description of where you thought the problem might be, that's all.

 

[Agile]

When you have posted the result of the tests then I might tell you what seems to be wrong.

It would just waste my time if I were to give you a full technical description ( which you might not be able to understand anyway ) at every stage which might need several different tests before the fault is identified.

I give my time free to help people, some of whom are too mean to call a boiler repair engineer, but I dont waste my time beyond identifying the fault. If you want training then take a Gas NVQ and the assessments then sign up to an apprentiship with British Gas or a better firm if you can find one.

Tony

 

[ThaiStyle]

When you have posted the result of the tests then I might tell you what seems to be wrong.

It would just waste my time if I were to give you a full technical description ( which you might not be able to understand anyway ) at every stage which might need several different tests before the fault is identified.

I give my time free to help people, some of whom are too mean to call a boiler repair engineer, but I dont waste my time beyond identifying the fault. If you want training then take a Gas NVQ and the assessments then sign up to an apprentiship with British Gas or a better firm if you can find one.

Tony

As I said, all I was asking for was a brief description.

I understand that you guys give up your free time to help people like me out. And, it is appreciated.

And, no, I'm not 'too mean' to call an engineer out. I actually have a contract with British Gas and I plan to call them out again (as already mentioned, they have replaced the heat sensor). I just wanted to get an idea of where the problem might be because BG engineers have a habit of trying to fob us off by saying that there isn't a problem with the boiler. I'm trying to determine if this is a boiler problem or a general plumbing problem.

Anyway, I'll try the test and will report back with the results.

 

[gigz]

This test will tell you if your diverter valve is the problem (left hand pipe shouldn't get hot when you turn hot water on). Also try turning the flow rate down on the bath tap (the slower it goes the hotter it will get) thats unless as Agile said you have a mixing problem. Whats the hot tap like on the basin ?

 

[ThaiStyle]

This test will tell you if your diverter valve is the problem (left hand pipe shouldn't get hot when you turn hot water on). Also try turning the flow rate down on the bath tap (the slower it goes the hotter it will get) thats unless as Agile said you have a mixing problem. Whats the hot tap like on the basin ?

The hot tap on the basin is also poor - at best, it's 'warm' but mostly luke-warm which tells me that the problem is not specifically with the bath or shower.

Is turning down the flow rate a simple job?

Thanks.

 

[GodKnows]

Turning down the flow rate at the tape is a simple job, even the monkeys in the zoo can do that, it's called turning the tap You will restrict the flow coming out of the boiler, thereby giving it time to heat the hot water more, you will have to allow more time to fill the bath thou....

I suspect what tony said, but also maybe, when the new boiler was fitted did they take out the 22mm hot water pipe and fit 15mm (If it is an old house) Also, the run might go around your house a long way with many bends, this can restrict the flow and decrease the efficiency of the water upstairs fella...

 

[ThaiStyle]

Turning down the flow rate at the tape is a simple job, even the monkeys in the zoo can do that, it's called turning the tap You will restrict the flow coming out of the boiler, thereby giving it time to heat the hot water more, you will have to allow more time to fill the bath thou....

I suspect what tony said, but also maybe, when the new boiler was fitted did they take out the 22mm hot water pipe and fit 15mm (If it is an old house) Also, the run might go around your house a long way with many bends, this can restrict the flow and decrease the efficiency of the water upstairs fella...

OK - just call me a doofus....

I'm sure I have tried that but will give it another go just to confirm.

I have no idea if they changed the pipes when installing the new boiler to be honest. The house is old (1930s).

 

[Agile]

I would like to see a measurement of the flow rate in litres per minute from the basin and from the bath taps.

If you can turn off the cold water inlet to the boiler then you could do another test from each hot tap.

After turning off the flow into the boiler you then go to each tap and turn it anticlockwise to "turn it on" and then see if any water comes out!

There is another possibility and thats the hot pipes to "upstairs" may be steel or lead embedded in the walls. These lose a lot of heat and of course nowadays would be in 15 mm copper with thick insulation.

Tony