Opinions on shower problem

[baps]

Hi folks,

Have had a problem with a power shower for some time. When we start the shower, it will occasionally start to whine in increasing volume and pitch until the flow stops. If we turn the temperature dial all the way to cold, the shower pump (I'm assuming) returns to its normal sound, flow starts again. We adjust the temperature back to normal, pump starts to wind up again, flow stops, rinse and repeat. Eventually, it will work properly and we can finally get a shower.

Have had several plumbers attempt to fix this problem. Two have been adamant the shower is faulty, so we've had 3 power showers at this point. One changed pipes and the hot water cylinder, one said it was fine (because maybe half the time it works fine) and charged us for nothing. The problem is exactly the same after all this expense.

So we've had another plumber look at it, and he's suggesting the shower should never have been plumbed as it is. It's currently plumbed up from the hot tank, across the attic (less than 2m), and down to the shower. His suggestion is the hot water is getting airlocked and needs to be plumbed down, under the floor and up to the shower. Airlock sounds possible I guess, but he's quoting roughly £1000 to correct this, since it means ripping up floor, tracking wall, removing shower enclosure etc.

So I was wondering if we could get a broader opinion on the problem before going to more expense? Sounds like it could be possible. Have attached an artwork masterpiece trying to show the current layout.

Many thanks,

Baps.

 

[hazetimesfive]

I hope you haven't paid for any of that.

 

[seco services]

photo will be better than you pic. pic of hw connection to hw cylinder.
what shower is it ?
up and over pipework is perfectly ok for showers if done correctly.

 

[Madrab]

If the hot feed to the shower is from the top of the cylinder, as in your drawing, that's the problem. As your last plumber has pointed out, air bubbles will be getting drawn in by the pump, causing cavitation, that's what the noise is and it will eventually damage the impeller.

 

[baps]

I hope you haven't paid for any of that.

Paid for all of it and got nowhere. Quite annoying as you can imagine, which is why I gave up after the last attempt.

photo will be better than you pic. pic of hw connection to hw cylinder.
what shower is it ?
up and over pipework is perfectly ok for showers if done correctly.

Can't really take a pic of how it's plumbed, and that's what this plumber is suggesting is the problem. Have attached a pic of the connection to the cylinder. Can see the new plastic piping one of the guys added. Surely, surely can't be the shower if we've now had 3 and they've all had the same problem? This one is a triton thermostatic power shower.

Thanks guys!

Baps.

 

[Newboy]

The hot water feed to the shower is wrong. It needs a flange connection to prevent air being drawn into the pipework. May also need bleed valves fitted to the high point in the pipework.

 

[Madrab]

That's nonsense pipework, there's your issue, the shower will be drawing in air bubbles from the cylinder.

 

[baps]

The hot water feed to the shower is wrong. It needs a flange connection to prevent air being drawn into the pipework. May also need bleed valves fitted to the high point in the pipework.

That's nonsense pipework, there's your issue, the shower will be drawing in air bubbles from the cylinder.

So is this a pretty obvious thing or why would it not have been easy to fix? I'm assuming replumbing the whole thing is not needed?

Baps.

 

[Madrab]

It should be obvious to a plumber that understand the mechanics behind correctly planning and commissioning a pumped shower.

You can use up and over pipework as Seco mentions, just need special care to avoid air getting into the hot feed using a cylinder flange as NewBoy mentions. Then ensure the up and over pipework stays below the cold tank level. An air vent might need added at the highest point, to bleed the system, if you can't get adequate flow at the shower to bleed it at that stage.

 

[jeff the gasman]

You certainly haven't had any plumbers in. Unlucky but simple fix.

 

[baps]

Well to be fair to the other guys, the last plumber in did that pipework and new cylinder, so I guess it could have been different before that.

Might have to go find another plumber then. Here goes the search again!

Baps.

 

[AGAS]

you don't necessarily need to connect straight on top of cylinder , it can be connected further down from horizontal pipework would probably be easier ( if you have the space , judging from picture you may have ) as jeff has said its an easy fix providing higher pipework is correct .

 

[Madrab]

The brass blank, where the immerser would normally live, can be drilled and a 22mm dip tube soldered in, perfect for a separate air free shower feed. Once the up and over circuit's been checked as ok, then it's an easy connection.