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Party wall act (EWI) requested

Discussion in 'Building' started by Damnboy, 4 Jan 2016.

  1. Damnboy

    Damnboy

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    Hi, I recently bought semi detached house, I have almost zero knowledge about housing/insulation/planning etc..

    Recently my neighbour sent request for ewi insulation as its party wall (gap between my and their house) they required party act stuffs and requested me to sign documents so they can start work.

    I am bit unsure if I should sign document or reject, there are disadvantage and advantage of having insulation on party wall and biggest advantage of energy saving + noise and biggest disadvantage of potential damp.


    Other set of information on document are; such as 100mm EPS (thickness), no disruption to neighbour's (I.e me) and fixing wall, fences, satellite dish etc if required temporary removal.

    Could anyone guide me should I reject or accept request?

    Is there anything to worry about here? Being nice neighbour is good, but having not known person next door is there anything I need to be aware of?

    Cheers
     
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  3. nebjamin

    nebjamin

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    I would speak to your neighbour or the insulation co to get more details, as they'll probably only overlap a tiny bit of the party wall on the outside of the building.

    I.e, with EWI (External) they are not insulating their side of the party wall but on the front and rear elevations the EWI will overlap the ends of the party wall by 50%, hence the need for permission. With EWI they are NOT insulating the whole of the party wall.

    The only disadvantage I can think of is that it can look a bit odd - as their walls will be 100mm proud of yours, and it will end in a step at the party wall.

    You won't get any advantages from their insulation as your house will still be uninsulated.
     
  4. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    I can't understand how a neighbour can insulate the exterior of a party wall.
     
  5. Damnboy

    Damnboy

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    Thank you for the response , as advised i will speak with insulation company and neighbour both for further details asap, these are details as mentioned in notice:

    Installation of External Wall Insulation (EWI) A Brief Summary:
    This EWI is not load bearing or disruptive to neighbouring properties. There is no requirement to carry out any structural works to the party wall, nor to any part of your property.

    Summary:
    > scaffolding is erected
    > Temporarily remove rainwater pipes, soil, pipes, satellite dishes, alarms ...
    > 100 mm thick EPS (Fire redundant lightweight expanded polystyrene) insulation board is fixed onto the existing house walls (above damp proof course).
    > Render is applied
    > All pipes satellite dishes etc fixed.
    > scaffolding removed.

    Looks like i miss-understood looking at images found over google (my assumption was this whole thing was about filling up gab between the two walls as well as other external side's of neighbour's property as title was to install external wall insulation as an energy saving measure.)

    @nebjamin; http://gogreena.co.uk/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven/images/EWI-example-1.jpg (is this similar to what you are talking about being proud off 100mm thickness? i.e red house in the image?)

    Many thanks for advice.
    Cheers
     
  6. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    If you are in any doubt, then don't sign.

    In that case, a "dispute" will occur and then surveyors will be involved to take care of your interests. Either a joint surveyor for both of you, or you can have one each. The neighbour will pay for all this.

    It's still not clear to me what they are planning to do on the party wall, but with external insulation, you do really want to ensure that it is detailed correctly to avoid damp problems and that it will not prevent you doing work on your property in the future.

    If you are unsure in any way, then don't sign.
     
  7. nebjamin

    nebjamin

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    @Damnboy yes that photo shows what I meant with it sticking out 100mm proud of your side. Admittedly that is a particularly ugly example as it's on a terrace and there are no downpipes which often soften the step. Plus they have a trim at the top because there isn't enough roof overhang, which makes it look pretty awful IMHO.

    I think this is a better looking result: http://www.netweber.co.uk/typo3temp/pics/f3c9744d1e.jpg You can see how the drainpipe softens the join a bit.

    @^woody^ Regarding the party wall, I think it's the ends of the party wall since part of them may be covered in insulation.

    From this doc: https://www.havering.gov.uk/Documents/Planning/external-wall-insulation.pdf

    If you want to insulate a Party Wall (even if it is just the end of the party wall where it joins the front elevation) a Party Wall agreement will be required. A Party Wall Notice should therefore be sought at the same time as the Building Notice.
     
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  9. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    That's what I can't understand. The EWI placed on the front of a property will be fixed up to the boundary and should not cross this. If it is does then its a property issue not a party wall issue, and it will need agreement under normal property law.

    A party wall does not extend to the external face of a building.
     
  10. Damnboy

    Damnboy

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    Thank you very much both of you for the valuable feedback.

    This is the message from insulation co:
    "To solve the issue regarding a gap between yourself and your neighbour is to obtain a party wall agreement. This will allow the contractor to install to the midpoint of the party wall."


    This suggests: this is what they are trying to achieve (if i am not wrong ) : http://specificationonline.co.uk/up...ty wall bypass_Knauf Insulation (640x452).jpg

    But again, I am still confused, how can they insulate only their half, if its full then as i said before there would be advantage of energy saving. And potentially there is also damn/thermal bridging issue.

    (Confused)
     
  11. nebjamin

    nebjamin

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    Think you ought to get into your loft and see if your party wall is hollow as you suspect.

    Despite what ^woody^ said (which is no doubt correct), some of the insulation co's don't know their arse from their elbow... my bet is it's a formality to allow them to insulate over the front and rear elevations where the party wall connects.
     
  12. cjard

    cjard

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    they can only insulate their half in the same way they can only paint their half bright pink if they choose. Imagine painting the house with 4 inch thick paint - that's what it'll look like when done. Party Wall notifications are required when a neighbour does any work near to a party wall - it could be digging a flower bed next to your fence. They don't have to be served

    Rather than looking to make an enemy of the neighbour, ****ing them off with the extra expense that your unreasonable rejection could put them to, why not get the company to do your house too, push for a discount as it's more business for them immediately adjacent to what they've already agreed.. A good neighbour is worth their weight in .. uh.. lead. A bad one, you pretty much have to move house to get away from, and come sell time and neighbour disputes are used by the purchaser to try and wangle more money off the sale you might well rue the day it all began, when the other option actually had considerable benefits for you..
     
  13. wessex101

    wessex101

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    I agree with Woody in post #7. I cannot see that fixing external wall insulation up to the boundary is a party wall issue as illustrated in the photo in post #4.

    Not sure how this has gone from external wall insulation to cavity wall insulation to the separating wall. Surely they are having external wall insulation because the property has solid walls. The benefits of injecting insulation into the separating wall if it had a cavity would be rather doubtful.
     
  14. cjard

    cjard

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    indeed, Wessex - something only needs insulating if there is a temperature gradient across it. if the rooms either side are the same ish temp then heat loss thru a party wall is negligible. In a sense its better not to insulate it, then when their house is warme everywhere else because of their EWI, more heat flows to the OPs house through the PW
     
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