Pumped shower will not start - airlocks

[AirlockLisa]

We have a very nice plumber who has redesigned and fitted the bathroom so we are not DIY-ing as such but I would really appreciate some advice.

Our plumbing is gravity-fed with a cold water tank in the loft and hot water cylinder (vented) in the airing cupboard. The plumber fitted an Aqualisa pumped smart valve, also in the loft, with a Quartz ‘smart touch’ digital shower in the bathroom with dual outlets (handset and ceiling drench head).

It was fitted about two months ago and has never worked reliably. When it starts, it’s great, but 99% of the time now it’s failing to start. The digital display works and calls the smartvalve. We hear the pump in the loft try to start. Some drips come out of the shower head but that’s all. We’ve tried running the basin hot tap and tried starting the shower on cold.

The plumber has been around multiple times. He can get rid of the airlock and it then starts up. But even a couple of hours later it won’t start again.

So far he has tried:

Anti gravity loop on hot water cylinder (this seemed to increase failure rate, it used to start around 20% of the time)

Surrey flange on hot water cylinder

Other fixes (unsure).

I’m worried he’s out of ideas and this is our only shower (no bath). He’s in touch with Aqualisa who advise this is not a product fault but instead an installation fault causing airlocks.

He is very decent by the way and wants to fix this to complete the bathroom installation.

Any thoughts/experiences welcome.

 

[Johntheo5]

If a Surrey flange then the HW is taken from the side and the vent is on the top. If a Warix type then the HW is taken from the Top and the Vent from the side. Post the exact type you have.

 

[CountryFan]

If the pump is in the loft (I’m not familiar with the shower) then a Surrey flange or similar should have been fitted. It could be something as simple as poor pipework Installation.

 

[HERTS P&D]

It could be something as simple as poor pipework Installation.

What he said!

Andy

 

[denso13]

Check it is all installed as per the manufacturer's instructions, which is critical. For example, the hot connection should be from the HW pipework, not the cylinder.

 

[AirlockLisa]

Thank you all! It’s a Surrey flange taking water from the top of the hot water cylinder. This wasn’t fitted at first but the plumber came back after the problems and fitted it then.

Apologies - I’m not sure what the difference is between the supply coming from the HW cylinder or HW pipe work. There’s pipes between the Surrey flange on the cylinder and the pumped smart valve so that the hot water can get from the cylinder to the loft, if that makes sense?

The installation diagrams/instructions weren’t all that clear to me as a complete novice but I’ll take another look.

Thanks all and apologies for complete plumbing naivety!

 

[denso13]

Apologies - I’m not sure what the difference is between the supply coming from the HW cylinder or HW pipe work.

It's about following the MI's. The HW should come from the HW pipework.

 

[AirlockLisa]

Sorry again - what are the MIs? Installation instructions?

Does having piping between the cylinder and the unit count as pipework?

Thank you!

 

[CountryFan]

Sorry again - what are the MIs? Installation instructions?

Yes. Manufacturers instructions.

 

[Johntheo5]

Thank you all! It’s a Surrey flange taking water from the top of the hot water cylinder. This wasn’t fitted at first but the plumber came back after the problems and fitted it then.

Apologies - I’m not sure what the difference is between the supply coming from the HW cylinder or HW pipe work. There’s pipes between the Surrey flange on the cylinder and the pumped smart valve so that the hot water can get from the cylinder to the loft, if that makes sense?

Yours should look like the attached, (if a Surrey flange). Take a photo if possible, and post.

 

[AirlockLisa]

Thank you so much and I do apologise for the delay - away from home at the moment.

Is this what you’d expect to see?

Many thanks!

 

[denso13]

this what you’d expect to see?

Not if the manufacturer's instructions were followed, which is why I suggested to check the whole installation is as it should be.

 

[AirlockLisa]

Thank you - what looks wrong to you/against the manufacturers instructions?

 

[denso13]

The hot connection should be on the horizontal hot from the cylinder, before the tee, or on the vertical hot, below the tee.

 

[Johntheo5]

The hot connection should be on the horizontal hot from the cylinder, before the tee, or on the vertical hot, below the tee.

If the horizontal right (from the Surrey Flange) is going to the Shower pump/valve and the vertical is the vent, then installed correctly? but the vent pipe should be sloping upwards with 45deg elbows until it connects to the vertical. What T are you referring to?.