Radiator with no TRV (and two lockshield valves?)

[davidw87]

Hi

I have a Greenstar 24i Junior combi boiler and a central heating system with a radiator in the bathroom, living room, dining room/kitchen and each of the three bedrooms.

All the radiators have TRVs except the ones in the living room, dining room/kitchen and bathroom. The dining room has valves as shown below on the left and right of the radiator. (I think these are lockshield valves.)

The living room radiator is 75cm wide while the dining one is 150cm wide. This means the dining area tends to get too warm as it has a bigger radiator. The thermostat's in the living room.

Would it be possible to adjust the valves on the dining room radiator to turn it down (or even turn it off given the area usually gets warm in the evening from cooking)? If so, would I adjust the left or right one?

Thanks for any help!

 

[DP]

It is the wheel head that determines the valve being a lock shield or control. Lock shield cap does not move the spindle. Control wheel head is attached to the spindle therefore you can adjust the circulation through the radiator. Both valves are identical ( in your case anyway)

 

[Madrab]

you would need to get at least one new wheel head cap to fit those valves so you could turn them on and off. They would not really allow the radiator to be run cooler rather just on and off. Either valve would tuurn it off.

That being said those valves look old and may not like being used and may start to leak. Only trial and error would show that. May be an idea to get at least one new valve fitted.

Are the rooms open plan or separate?

 

[fixitflav]

Would it be possible to adjust the valves on the dining room radiator to turn it down (or even turn it off given the area usually gets warm in the evening from cooking)? If so, would I adjust the left or right one?

Yes, but the valves go 8-10 turns from open to closed. Don't expect any serious throttling if you just close it a couple of turns, close it fully then open it about 1/2 a turn initially, then trim to suit.
I think I would throttle on the inlet valve (the one that gets hot first) but it probably doesn't make any difference.

 

[davidw87]

you would need to get at least one new wheel head cap to fit those valves so you could turn them on and off. They would not really allow the radiator to be run cooler rather just on and off. Either valve would tuurn it off.

That being said those valves look old and may not like being used and may start to leak. Only trial and error would show that. May be an idea to get at least one new valve fitted.

Are the rooms open plan or separate?

The dining room/kitchen is open plan, but separated from the living room by a door.

As mentioned in the other reply, I assume if I leave a valve slightly open then it would take longer to warm up?

Therefore by the time the main thermostat turns off, the radiator won't have warmed up as much. I guess it'd still get hot if the heating stayed on long enough though.

 

[Madrab]

leave a valve slightly open then it would take longer to warm up

Yes it would but it would eventually get to the same temp unless really finely tuned to how much heat the rad loses to the air but yes it could be set like that.

 

[fixitflav]

As mentioned in the other reply, I assume if I leave a valve slightly open then it would take longer to warm up?

Yes, that's unavoidable with a simple throttle. Whereas a TRV would be wide open until set temperature approached, then close down. My assumption, but I doubt whether you would know much difference in practice.

 

[ericmark]

I had problems with mothers house, I was told should not have a TRV in same room as the wall thermostat, however it also says the wall thermostat should be in a room on lower floor, normally kept cool, with no alternative heating, and no outside doors, and such a room rarely exists.

So we have to compromise, and after trying all sorts, with wireless thermostat I could move room to room, and using electronic TRV heads, what in the end cured my problems was fitting a TRV to the hall radiator where the original wall thermostat was.

I had to readjust the lock shield valves, but basic idea was, door opened and TRV turns on, reheating hall fast until nearly at wall thermostat setting, the TRV turns down slowing the heating of hall for last few degrees, so the rest of the house could also heat up. And it worked.

However it does depend on the home, my last one was open plan, and one thermostat down stairs worked well, TRV's only fitted up stairs.

This house needs some work, it's not the heating which is a problem but the cooling, I am hoping some double glazed windows will help, but hall cools too slowly, so any lowering of wall thermostat temperature, and all rooms other than hall get too cool before hall thermostat kicks in. I may try a cradle for thermostat and put it in living room powered by USB.

I say this as every house is different, also lock shield valves, some makes needed 2.5 turns on, other 1/2 turn only, again the instructions are great, set radiator so 15 degrees between feed and return, I tried, and realised I need a differential thermostat to do it, the aim at device thermostat just did not give a steady enough reading.

I tried turning the lock shield off, waiting for pipes to cool, then turning on 1/4 turn at a time until felt a little warmth, it did give me a start point but not spot on, I used the report from the electronic TRV head it shows current and target, and if current exceeded target I closed to lock shield a small amount, and I got mother house spot on that way, but it has not worked that well with this house, mainly as boiler is on/off not modulating, so hall thermostat turns off, and it takes too long to turn on again.

Every home is different, not only the way the heating heats the home, but when the home needs heating, our best option seems to be in the morning starting at over night 17 degrees, we turn up hall temperature 0.5 degrees every two hours, this means boiler regularly turns on, with little over shoot, and it works reasonably OK, but has room for improvement, however I had geofencing set up, so leaving house dropped to 17 degrees again. On returning it would then over shoot. So turned off geofencing in the end. And since rarely both of us out of the house in winter not a problem.

But if we still went out to work, would need some thing different, so life style matters.

 

[Johntheo5]

The living room radiator is 75cm wide while the dining one is 150cm wide. This means the dining area tends to get too warm as it has a bigger radiator. The thermostat's in the living room.

View attachment 278188 View attachment 278189

Why not another TRV on the dining room rad?, you still have overall controll with the living room roomstat, mine works fine that way.