Re-Painted Front Door Nightmare

[corvus]

Recently repainted our exterior door, did all the prep (sanded, sugar soap, rinse, dry), patiently applied primer (Sandtex High Performance Primer). Followed all instructions, drying times and general advice. Left the door for days. Then applied a single coat of Sandtex High Performance Gloss Paint - Pillar Box Red, waited 24 hours (it advised 16 hours) and applied a second coat. This is where everything went wrong. Returned home from work to find two panels had "wrinkled" despite waiting more than the quoted time and applying a thin coat with a decent brush. Only two panels in separate areas of the door. Pretty angry at this point, but I think I'll just sand it down and do those two areas again. Except the paint is tacky all over the door so that it sticks every time we open and close the door. It was left for over a week and still sticks whenever we get home.

Any idea what the problem is here? Definitely didn't apply too thickly or to paint not already dried sufficiently. Need to get this sorted while the dry weather holds out and can't see where I went wrong. Worried about sanding down still tacky paint and smearing the whole panel and worried it will always be tacky even if we get a smooth finish. The door frame wasn't repainted at the same time, but could the sticking be due to both surfaces being gloss paint? Return home every day to see this and getting really frustrated with an entire house to decorate still.

 

[JohnD]

wrinkling (crocodiling) does usually mean the paint was too thick or the coats underneath not fully dried, as I gather you know. This includes the primer and undercoat.

So if you're sure that wasn't it, let me ask:

does the Sandtex system not recommend an undercoat?

did you thin any of the coats?

Have you done much gloss painting before? (sorry)

What was the old coating on the door before you started?

Is the door exposed to the sun?

 

[corvus]

Hey, no need to apologise, I've painted with gloss more than I care to have done, because it's such a pain if you don't do the prep properly. Never had this problem when I fulled prepped the surfaces before, but only dealt with it when painting window frames and exteriors. In fact, we're currently battling to sand an entire hallway that was painted peach with thick gloss sometime in the '70s so we can re-paint that too. Lots of fun in the evenings at the moment.

does the Sandtex system not recommend an undercoat? we used the Sandtex primer and left for days before applying the red exterior paint. This was recommended and we used so as not to mix brands of paint.

did you thin any of the coats? No thinning, two coats straight from the tin a day apart, Sandtex recommended 16 hours.

What was the old coating on the door before you started? Old coating was a dark green paint that had been there for 20+ years so gloss had worn off leaving a powdery colour, we sanded this down, sugar soaped and dried before applying the primer undercoat.

Is the door exposed to the sun? North facing door that hasn't seen sun all year Days during prep and painting were overcast but dry. Trying to get this done before the weather gets any worse because we don't get a break from rain, wind and sleet when it starts.


I'm, confused because only two panels slid and wrinkled but the entire door is still sticky which obviously points to another problem.

 

[JohnD]

Is it an old house that might previously have had a linseed oil paint on it? Or a hardwood door that might once have been varnished or oiled?

It will be very hard to sand off crocodiled paint is it is jelly underneath, you might have to scrape or burn off. If you end up doing that, I'd be inclined to go right back to bare wood to remove whatever the cause was.

p.s. you could also try the Sandtex helpline http://www.sandtex.co.uk/

Red paint is notorious for poor coverage, don't know why.

 

[corvus]

Should have said the house was built in 1860, but the door is no more than 15 years old. It only happened when second coat was applied as well. Lucky the two panels are enclosed so no hassle stripping back to the bare wood and starting over. I would feel better doing this to get it done right. Won't solve the sticky issue but I'll see if sanding the door frame solves this issue.

 

[JohnD]

if the frame paint is dry to the touch and hard to the thumbnail, you can rub it with vaseline on a rag on the contact edge to prevent sticking. Just leave the tiniest trace.

 

[corvus]

Brilliant, it's only a small part of the frame in contact with the door so that's an ideal solution. Fingers crossed these panels are as simple to fix. Luckily they were thin layers so not so much a jelly consistency as smearing when we use the sandpaper. Probably scrape as much off as possible before going at it again, but it eventually bobbles enough to remove completely. Could be worse I suppose.

 

[Growler]

The problem here is gloss on gloss when the previous coat had not cured properly. Sandtex is terrible for this and as John D enquired about which way the door is facing means that it's even less likely to cure before the second gloss because of lack of heat.
This is one of those occassions where it makes no odds what the instructions say.
If that door had've been exposed to the sun in summer, you might have got away with it but even then, I wouldn't be sure.

It's getting cold out there.

 

[corvus]

Was reading about the new 2010 paints on a professional forum I can't join, and it looks as if there are many problems with the new formula if painted in >80% humidity (which in this country may be close to impossible). A lot of complaints:

http://www.bib-n-braces.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1002&p=7625&hilit=wrinkling#p7625

I wonder if this might be the problem and if there are any alternatives.

 

[corvus]

Thanks growler, as you say it is only going to get worse weather wise, will strip the panels tonight, re-do the prep and apply a thin single layer when weather permits. No second coat this time unless I'm 100% sure it is cured as you say. May be March/April Just relieved we got lucky with other 90% of the door. No idea about brands, Sandtex had the colour we were after and decent reviews. There won't be a next time thankfully!

 

[Bolshie]

Ive just re-painted my daughter's front door with this paint (only Oxford Blue version) and had exactly the same experience as you! I also did all the correct preparation and used the correct undercoat, together with a new brush. I left it for three days after the undercoat, and the door looked lovely when finished, apart from a few areas where the coverage of the gloss seemed a bit thin. Rather than put too much on, I decided to leave it for a few days and then give it a second coat. However as the paint dried (it was a lovely warm day with a light breeze and the door is under a balcony so in the shade) to my horror it started to wrinkle, and there was nothing I could do!
It took forever to dry, so in the end I left it for a week. After is time I thought it would be OK to rub down and repaint. No! What a mission!! Wet and dry wouldn't touch it, so I ended up using coarse sandpaper to remove the wrinkles. It took me half a day but I figured it would be worth it to do a good job. Once again it looked lovely when finished and although I didn't put much on, the second coat covered over the thin areas, so I went home happy.
Imagine how I felt when my daughter rang me the following morning to say that the door was if anything worse than before and sent me photos to prove it. I have never had any problems painting doors with other types of paint, (and I have done plenty of them over the last 34 years of home ownership believe me!)
I am now considering burning the whole lot off and starting from scratch with a normal brand of paint. What a disappointment and so discouraging!!!

 

[arco123]

I have had a similar experience. After sanding down, washing and then undercoating the door it took so long to dry (it was late October and the outside temperatures were around 11 degrees so it shouldn't have been a problem) that I decided to wait for around eight months for really warm weather to apply a second coat. I did this at the beginning of July when the outside temperatures were in the 20s not imagining the problem would repeat itself. But I was wrong and if anything it's worse than the first time. After two weeks it's still a bit tacky so obviously it will be several months before it is completely dry. I seem to remember noticing it was completely dry around four months later. I contacted Sandtex who actually refunded my money but obviously there is a serious problem with this paint. Sandtex are clearly aware of this but unbelievably they are still selling it. In a word this paint is rubbish.