Screwed up somehow, help!

[pritchetts]

I have had a look at the wiki and cant find an exact match for this so hopefully its not a duplicate post.

I set about replacing a couple of light fittings in my living room (2 fittings controlled by 1 switch. These are part of a ring consisting of 2 lights in the living room going on to 1 light in the dining room and 2 further lights in the kitchen controlled by a double switch.

Now for the problem, I fitted the new lights. This basically consisted of removing the E, L & N from the chocolate boxes i have currently and connecting the wires from the new lights to the chocolate boxes. EASY right?
Wrong.

Some how now the switch in the living room trips the circuit and the switch in the kitchen makes the living room light activate and kind of half powers the light its meant to.

I am completely lost and have been at it all day now

From what I can tell the ring is still complete because the lights do come on all round the house. I think the problem lies with the switched live, but i think I can see more than 1. There is a black wire with a red sleeve and also a yellow wire with a red sleeve.

Any help / advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

 

[Softus]

The basic principle is to find out which wires are going to through the switch. The live conductor to the first rose (and the one that goes to the next room) should be connected to one of the switch terminals, and a wire from the other switch terminal should be connected to the live for the light(s). The neutrals from the lights should connect to the incoming neutral (and the one that goes to the next room).

Isolate the circuit, turn on the switch, and check for continuity between each pair of reds of conductors at the first ceiling rose.

It's hard to help more than that without you saying which wire goes to/from where; saying that there is a yellow wire isn't enough information.

BTW, I doubt that you have a "ring" - it's commonly called a loop, but it's a radial circuit.

 

[fireman22]

the light comes on dimmer than it should like if it is on a dimmer? if so it mean you have wired light in series. have you only replaced one light fitting?

 

[pritchetts]

Ok, heres what I can see; (forgive me if it seems like rubbish )

Living room;

Fitting 1;

red wire connected to red wire
black wire, yellow write with red sleeve to brown wire (on fitting)
blue wire with black sleeve to blue wire (on fitting)
earth to earth

Fitting 2;

2 red wires to red wire
black wire with red sleeve + yellow wire with red sleeve to brown wire (on fitting)
blue wire with black sleeve and black wire to blue wire (on fitting)
earth to earth

I am fairly confident that all this is correct because it was fine before i fitted the new fixtures this morning. I merely changed the fittings and left the architecture in place and everything went bonkers.

The stupid thing is the light work but only when switched on in the kitchen, using the living room switch trips the circuit.

 

[pritchetts]

the light comes on dimmer than it should like if it is on a dimmer? if so it mean you have wired light in series. have you only replaced one light fitting?

Exactly like if it were on a dimmer. I have replaced 2 fittings that are activated from the same switch.

 

[fireman22]

wait, answer my question how many lights have you changed?

 

[pritchetts]

Thought I had, sorry.

2.

 

[Softus]

The stupid thing is the light work but only when switched on in the kitchen

It sounds as though you've connected the loop out from the kitchen rose to the kitchen switch.

using the living room switch trips the circuit.

That'll be because you've connected the loop live to one switch terminal and loop neutral to the other, so closing the switch joins live to neutral with no load, hence a short circuit and a very successful test of the MCB.

 

[fireman22]

stop operating that switch that blown the breaker or the contacts may weld together and you will need a new switch, leave it in whatever position it is in at the moment. at this point i will hand you over to softus and watch

 

[Lectrician]

Is it just a single switch bringing on both lounge lights?

What cables are behind this switch?

Explain more in detail what you have at the lights - for example - a two core cable with red and black, and three core cable with red, yellow and blue etc etc.

 

[pritchetts]

Sorry, went to bed, I was very tired (and annoyed with myself!)

The stupid thing is the light work but only when switched on in the kitchen

It sounds as though you've connected the loop out from the kitchen rose to the kitchen switch.

Can this happen even though i havent touched anything in the kitchen?

using the living room switch trips the circuit.

That'll be because you've connected the loop live to one switch terminal and loop neutral to the other, so closing the switch joins live to neutral with no load, hence a short circuit and a very successful test of the MCB.

I considey myself officially blinded with science now!! LOL.

 

[pritchetts]

Is it just a single switch bringing on both lounge lights?

Yes, thats right.

What cables are behind this switch?

2 cables, 1 black with red sleeve (appears to be 1 piece of copper) and 1 red wire also 1 piece of copper

Explain more in detail what you have at the lights - for example - a two core cable with red and black, and three core cable with red, yellow and blue etc etc.

Fitting 1 has 2 three core cables;
Cable 1 contains black, red and copper which is covered with an earth sleeve.
Cable 2 contains yellow with red sleeve, red and blue with black sleeve and copper with goes into the same earth sleeve as cable 1.

The 2 red wires from each cable are connected.

Black from cable 1 and yellow from cable 2 to L on fitting.
Blue on cable 2 to N on fitting
Combined earth to E on fitting

All via a chocolate box.

Fitting 2 is a little more trickey, looks like 3 3 core cables;
Cable 1 contains black with red sleeve, red and copper which is covered with an earth sleeve.
Cable 2 contains black, red and copper which is covered with an earth sleeve.
Cable 3 contains yellow with red sleeve, red and blue with black sleeve and copper with goes into the same earth sleeve as cable 1.

The three red wires are connected.

Black with red sleeve (cable 1) and yellow (cable 3) with red sleeve are connected to L on fitting.
Blue with black sleeve (Cable 3) and black (Cable 2) are connected to N on fitting
Combined earth to E on fitting

Hopefully this all makes sense!!

 

[Lectrician]

Difficult to understand your descriptions, but I believe you should have something like this:

Earths ommited for clarity! L is PERMENANTLY LIVE and SL is SWITCHED LIVE.

I would bet money on you having the two blacks muddled in the light I have marked as light 2 - Swip them over

Having those to black transposed, you would trip the MCB when ever the lounge switch was operated, and when any other lights to the right of the picture are turned on, they would operate dimly, and the lounge lights would also come on dimly.

 

[securespark]

After lots of head scratching, I concur!

 

[pritchetts]

Difficult to understand your descriptions, but I believe you should have something like this:

Earths ommited for clarity! L is PERMENANTLY LIVE and SL is SWITCHED LIVE.

I would bet money on you having the two blacks muddled in the light I have marked as light 2 - Swip them over

Having those to black transposed, you would trip the MCB when ever the lounge switch was operated, and when any other lights to the right of the picture are turned on, they would operate dimly, and the lounge lights would also come on dimly.

Absolutely spot on, many thanks!! Thanks to everyone for taking the time to respond.