shower feed

[fannybaws]

Hi,

I am looking for some advice on this topic and thought I would add to this thread rather than start another.

if the existing supplies are balanced use them

When you say balanced how balanced do they need to be ?

I am planning to take a feed from my cold & hot water tanks in the loft for a power shower. I would estimate the Cold water tank will be about a 2m difference in height (head is the technical word I believe ) Cold water tank about 4m above the shower (sitting on rafters in loft) Hot water 2m above (on loft floor).

- Would this cause a problem ? i.e cold pressure too high? (0.2 bar diff?)

My cold tank is a big plastic mother which I plan to cut with a hole saw. Any advice on a good type of grommet to use in the tank ? Piping will be 15mm for both hot and cold. Noticed power shower instructions say not to use bonding on joints which is a surprise I suppose it could clog the shower pump filter ? I planned to murder every joint with 477 or the like.

Also what type of pipes would the pro's use to make the cold connection ? Copper, plastic or flexible plastic ?

I think I have got lucky and there is an existing T-piece with an unused outlet for the hot supply, I guess I would be better to use copper for the hot pipe?

Any help, greatly appreciated.

Jamie
_____________________

Moderator
split from hi-jacked post

please do not as you said

and thought I would add to this thread rather than start another.

 

[kevplumb]

difference in head shouldnt matter
you need a 15/mm tank connector
pipework is up to you but i would use copper

 

[fannybaws]

Cheers Kevplumb

Copper it is

 

[kevplumb]

 

[colinc]

There is no difference in head in this arrangement.

Even though the cold pipe leaves the cold tank higher higher than the hot pipe leaves the hot tank, the effective head at the shower outlet for both the hot and cold pipes is the same because both are ultimately subject to the head of water in the vertical column measured down from the water level in the cold tank down to the shower head.

Hope that helps,

Colin

 

[kevplumb]

didnt i more or less say that

 

[namsag]

Hot take off to cylinder from tank should be higher than cold take off to shower so that if a long shower is taken hot water runs out first to avoid possible scalding.

 

[fannybaws]

Cheers Peeps!

As the Hot tank is fed from the cold tank the head is the same then (I think that is what you are saying). Kevplumbs answer did the trick then, cheers mate!

I'm fitting a thermostatic shower to avoid any scolding as mentioned !

Thanks again for all the advice.

 

[brumylad]

The hot supply from the copper cylinder should idealy be taken off using a suurey or essex flange.

 

[fannybaws]

Finally getting round to this job after the festive period!

Brumylad (If your still there!),

I looked into those flanges you suggested - I was going to Tee into the hot supply to the downstairs taps originally !!

The Essex flange requires drilling the hot tank which I would like to avoid. And I've heard a novice can easily drop it into the tank

The surrey flange screws into the top of the tank which I like

Only question I have is - The top of my hot water tank already has a tee piece on it. Connected to it is - the vent pipe goes straight up (over the cws tank) and the hot water draw off for downstairs comes off the Tee horizontally and down.

I believe the Surrey flange has 2 outputs, the special shower outlet and one to take the existing draw offs.

If I put a Surrey flange on top of the tank (with outlet for shower) can I connect my Tee piece onto the outlet for the original draw offs ?
Is that allowable ?

cheers for any advice!

 

[fannybaws]

Would an immersion going in the top of the hot tank effect a surrey or essex flange ?

The Immersion is not used at the moment but may be in the future. What is the best thing to do ?
Drill the tank near the top and use just a tank connector, as the surrey flang may deprive the immersion of water if ever used?

Confused as to which is best. An essex flang could cause the immersion probs as well ??

If anybody has tackled this before I would be much oibliged for some guidance.

cheers.
Jim

 

[doitall]

Don't tee into the vent pipe or you will suck in air.

The Essex flange fitted 250mm from the top is the ideal way for connecting pumps, however you can use a warex fitting in the top if you don't want to drill the cylinder.

15mm is not suitably for any shower pump and should be 22mm minimum.

 

[fannybaws]

Cheers doitall.

Didn't fancy teeing into the vent pipe.

Was all set to fit an essex flange, even read and sussed out how to fit it with the wire

Then I read somwhere that if there is an immersion in the tank (Although its never been used, but might) the essex flange can cause the immersion problems. Do you know anything of that?

I'm drilling a hole for a 15mm feed from the cold tank so drilling the hot isn't such a big deal, and it means leaving the existing fittings on the top of the tank.

cheers for the reply doitall

 

[doitall]

Cheers doitall.

Didn't fancy teeing into the vent pipe.

Was all set to fit an essex flange, even read and sussed out how to fit it with the wire

Then I read somwhere that if there is an immersion in the tank (Although its never been used, but might) the essex flange can cause the immersion problems. Do you know anything of that?

I'm drilling a hole for a 15mm feed from the cold tank so drilling the hot isn't such a big deal, and it means leaving the existing fittings on the top of the tank.

cheers for the reply doitall

The immersion can be exposed to air if the pump sucks out more water than can enter the cylinder.

read my first reply, 15mm is no good for the feed to any pump and should be 22mm, the cylinder cold should be at least equal and ideal mthe next size up.

what pump are you fitting and its output pressure

 

[ChrisR]

Essex flange is easiest to fit. Then Warix then Surrey(pipes come out the wrong way round to suit existiing).
If your immersion would only be for emergencies stick a label on it saying "do not use this while showering"! The risk here isn't scalding as far I can see, it's exposing the element, which would make it overheat and bust.

I had an Aquastream pumped box-on the-wall shower off a 15mm essex flange and about 7m of plastic 15mm pipe, for 15 years or so no problems, and did get the stated 18litres/min from it. 22mm has to be the advice though, esecially for longer runs.