Shower Mystery

[danielbb]

Or one could connect the wires directly and put a self contained mcb unit in loft? which is probably what the old owners did because why would they disconnect it at consumer unit, could possibley be for extra safety i suppose.

 

[Adam_151]

It looks like you have room in your CU for an extra MCB, why do you want to put one in a separate enclosure and bodge some cables into the isolator to feed it?

 

[danielbb]

I dont want too, i probably wont be me doing it myself, and if i do it will def be checked.

I cant see how another mcb will fit, there is space but nothing to fix on, must be a way though, else why the blank spaces on cover.

Ill take another look

 

[danielbb]

Nope the cover suggests the other half is for a whole new block of mcbs and isolator, hence no place to fix another in.

Is the direct connecting with unit in loft not allowed?

 

[Adam_151]

Nope the cover suggests the other half is for a whole new block of mcbs and isolator, hence no place to fix another in.

Is the direct connecting with unit in loft not allowed?

No, you can't just bung some 6/10mm² in the isolator with only the suppliers fuse protecting it.

If you don't have space in your CU for more breakers, then split the tails with henleys and install a separate shower consumer unit http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?cId=102504&ts=30136&id=42858

 

[danielbb]

No, you can't just bung some 6/10mm² in the isolator with only the suppliers fuse protecting it.

Im not stupid, i never suggested that. you called that idea your suggesting a bodge just.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Nope the cover suggests the other half is for a whole new block of mcbs and isolator, hence no place to fix another in.

That's because you have a split-load board. There should be an RCD, supplied by the first busbar, supplying the second one, where you put circuits such as sockets likely to be used to supply portable equipment outdoors. Also a good place for shower MCBs.

No, you can't just bung some 6/10mm² in the isolator with only the suppliers fuse protecting it.

Im not stupid, i never suggested that. you called that idea your suggesting a bodge just.

You did suggest exactly that.

You drew exactly that.

Here it is in black & red:

I dont want too, i probably wont be me doing it myself, and if i do it will def be checked.

You're expending an awful lot of time and effort groping towards a solution for someone who is just interested in the answer but plans to have an electrician do the work.

Please lose the "probably" from your plans, you really don't know enough to be doing this, and asking odd questions here, as they occur to you, is not a way to learn...

 

[danielbb]

That's because you have a split-load board. There should be an RCD, supplied by the first busbar, supplying the second one, where you put circuits such as sockets likely to be used to supply portable equipment outdoors. Also a good place for shower MCBs.

Cheers, There is no second bus bar or RCD, is that the way to go then?

You're expending an awful lot of time and effort groping towards a solution for someone who is just interested in the answer but plans to have an electrician do the work.

Please lose the "probably" from your plans, you really don't know enough to be doing this, and asking odd questions here, as they occur to you, is not a way to learn...

I disagree, that and read books is the way to learn. Do you honestly think id turn on or connect anything in th CU before having it checked!!!


About the drawing. That 45 box it an mcb, don't know why i put a neutral wire running to it. If its wrong why not say instead of moaning. If you don't want to help me please dont reply.

Thankyou

 

[danielbb]

Thats how i meant it to look, other picture was misleading. I take it its wrong then, or against regulations to connect a wire like that to the bus bar.

Electrician is definately doing it now, but id still like to learn all the same.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Cheers, There is no second bus bar or RCD, is that the way to go then?

Yes.

You're expending an awful lot of time and effort groping towards a solution for someone who is just interested in the answer but plans to have an electrician do the work.

Please lose the "probably" from your plans, you really don't know enough to be doing this, and asking odd questions here, as they occur to you, is not a way to learn...

I disagree, that and read books is the way to learn.

The problem is that you don't know what you don't know. In other words, there may be some important knowledge that you need, but you have absolutely no idea that it exists, and absolutely no idea that you don't posess it, and so absolutely no chance that you'll ask about it. Only asking about things of which you have an awareness, and where you recognise a hole in your knowledge is not guaranteed to teach you what you need to know.

Do you honestly think id turn on or connect anything in th CU before having it checked!!!

People do, and so far your questions, the lack of answers to important ones you've been asked, and your failure to recognise the dreadful, potentially fatal, mistake in your plan for connecting an external MCB do not fill me with confidence...

About the drawing. That 45 box it an mcb, don't know why i put a neutral wire running to it. If its wrong why not say instead of moaning.

It's not the neutral wire that's the problem - of course you'll need one of those going to the enclosure - how else will you supply the shower with a neutral? I note that you don't show the earth wire though - another important consideration.

I was taking issue with your claim that you were not proposing to run 6/10mm² cable from the isolator to the external MCB, despite the fact that is what you drew, and that is what you almost certainly planned. Let's put it this way - you can't have been planning to use meter tails to connect it, which is probably what you would need to be safely protected by the service fuse, or you would have realised that there's no way you could have got them into the outgoing terminals of the isolator along with the existing neutral and busbar.

If you don't want to help me please dont reply.

And if you don't want to take advice, please don't ask for it.

Thats how i meant it to look, other picture was misleading. I take it its wrong then, or against regulations to connect a wire like that to the bus bar.

Electrician is definately doing it now, but id still like to learn all the same.

Yes it is wrong, and against the regulations, and dangerous unless the wire is thick enough (e.g. 25mm²) for the service fuse (e.g. 100A) to provide adequate protection. And it would probably be difficult to get a thick enough cable in there and ensure that it and the busbar were properly clamped down, and therefore that might be dangerous.

It is wrong, and against the regulations, and dangerous to use exposed single-insulated cables like that.

 

[danielbb]

The problem is that you don't know what you don't know. In other words, there may be some important knowledge that you need, but you have absolutely no idea that it exists, and absolutely no idea that you don't posess it, and so absolutely no chance that you'll ask about it. Only asking about things of which you have an awareness, and where you recognise a hole in your knowledge is not guaranteed to teach you what you need to know

Thats why its important to read.

And if you don't want to take advice, please don't ask for it.

Saying its just wrong with out an explanation aint much help, how would i learn from it.

People do, and so far your questions, the lack of answers to important ones you've been asked, and your failure to recognise the dreadful, potentially fatal, mistake in your plan for connecting an external MCB do not fill me with confidence...

That diagram is for an internal one, i put it to the left so the wires can be seen easily.

Yes it is wrong, and against the regulations, and dangerous unless the wire is thick enough (e.g. 25mm²) for the service fuse (e.g. 100A) to provide adequate protection. And it would probably be difficult to get a thick enough cable in there and ensure that it and the busbar were properly clamped down, and therefore that might be dangerous.

It is wrong, and against the regulations, and dangerous to use exposed single-insulated cables like that.

So for an internal MCB it must be connected by a bus bar never a short length of cable.

Thankyou for the post it was much more informative. The first diagram was for external the second an internal mcb, i have confused my self with references to both.

 

[danielbb]

Anyway thanks Adam_151 and ban-all-sheds, sorry for my crap diagrams Ill go read some books.