Supply cable question

[ban-all-sheds]

Basically if the main fuse

is on the wall which is coming down then SSE will NOT be able to do the work. If the cable which needs moving runs between the fuse, aka cutout, and the meter, then provided the cutout is a type which an SSE meter changer can open then they can do it.

But if the cutout needs moving, or is of a type which SSE cannot touch, then the DNO are the only people who can or will do it. And you'd better be sitting down when you get their quote for it.

Seriously - you need to get clear on what needs moving, and who will do it - the cost of moving the supply might cause you to change your plans for the building.

 

[RobertBM]

No, the main fuse on the end of the cable from the loft.

Also, judging by your diagram, you may need more cable to reach your new position, not less.

All fuses for the house are right next to the meter.

Not a problem with supply cable length as goes to the meter which is currently two feet off the ground and I want it out the way nearer the ceiling. If anything there should about three feet too much.

View media item 90204

 

[ban-all-sheds]

View media item 90204

So the cutout is on the wall which is being demolished.

You need to get a quote from the DNO to move the incoming service, and I suggest you do that as a matter of the highest priority.

I want it out the way nearer the ceiling.

You may do, but the meter operator will have a say in where it can end up. I suspect they might well mandate that it goes outside.

If anything there should about three feet too much.

Irrelevant now.

 

[westie101]

The type of cable going to the cut-out (the grey unit to the right of the meter) can only be shortened back by DNO staff after it has been made dead externally to the property.

No ifs, no buts, it is their property and MUST be dealt with by them, not a meter operative, not an electrician, not you and not by a mate of a mate.

If you want this done you need to get onto the DNO who will also move the meter itself.

No attempt should be made either to just move the board, there are no cable clamps within the cut-out so there is a risk of a severe short circuit inside which brings a risk of injury, fire or even death (no joke it DOES happen)

P.S. DNOs don't rip you off, you will be charged a standard fee based on time taken and materials used which because it is a non contestable job the charges are regulated by Ofgem

 

[RobertBM]

The type of cable going to the cut-out (the grey unit to the right of the meter) can only be shortened back by DNO staff after it has been made dead externally to the property.

No ifs, no buts, it is their property and MUST be dealt with by them, not a meter operative, not an electrician, not you and not by a mate of a mate.

If you want this done you need to get onto the DNO who will also move the meter itself.

No attempt should be made either to just move the board, there are no cable clamps within the cut-out so there is a risk of a severe short circuit inside which brings a risk of injury, fire or even death (no joke it DOES happen)

P.S. DNOs don't rip you off, you will be charged a standard fee based on time taken and materials used which because it is a non contestable job the charges are regulated by Ofgem

Well that is what I needed to know so thank you. Seen your name mentioned in the forums many times so I know you are knowledgeable on this subject.

I’m not someone who has things done on the cheap by getting an unqualified person to do it for a backhander, and especially when it comes to this type of job which is both dangerous and a potential fire risk.

As it stands I’ve put aside £600 for the DNO to move the cable and the same again for SSE to move the meter, although I’m hoping them upgrading it to a smart meter will deduct something. As for an electrician, all seem reluctant to give a quote until DNO and SSE have done their job. Don’t like that idea as I’ll be at their mercy with no supply!

I hear there are companies which sort out everything for you. Anyone used them before?

 

[westie101]

I hear there are companies which sort out everything for you. Anyone used them before?

And charge you for the privilege I'd avoid them!

I note in your photo that there is an isolator after the meter (to the right od the cut-out), get an electrician to change the CU and fit it in your preferred position. He will need to install long tails back to the isolator.

Then get the DNO to move the cut-out & meter (you may not need to involve the supplier as DNOs are permitted to move meters)

The DNO will move the cut-out, meter & isolator.
Then the electrician can revisit to shorten the tails to the isolator from the meter. (though in reality one of the DNO guys may just do that as a favor)

.I note from your location that your DNO is UK Power Networks, have a look on their website about Service Alterations they have some good information and links to get a price.
Note I suspect you have an overhead supply which is relevant to the costing

 

[RobertBM]

I hear there are companies which sort out everything for you. Anyone used them before?

And charge you for the privilege I'd avoid them!

I note in your photo that there is an isolator after the meter (to the right od the cut-out), get an electrician to change the CU and fit it in your preferred position. He will need to install long tails back to the isolator.

Then get the DNO to move the cut-out & meter (you may not need to involve the supplier as DNOs are permitted to move meters)

The DNO will move the cut-out, meter & isolator.
Then the electrician can revisit to shorten the tails to the isolator from the meter. (though in reality one of the DNO guys may just do that as a favor)

.I note from your location that your DNO is UK Power Networks, have a look on their website about Service Alterations they have some good information and links to get a price.
Note I suspect you have an overhead supply which is relevant to the costing

Thanks again Westie for such a quick reply. So nice to have someone so knowledgeable at the end of a keyboard.

Like most subjects, as soon as one question is answered a lot more need answering

Now I know there is a possibility of getting the DNO to move the meter I’m far less tempted to use one of those all-in-one companies. Thank you! It was only the fact they offered a seamless job without me having to organise all three to be here at the right time which tempted me. Now it’s only two, I’m feeling more confident it’s possible!

Yes, I sent an email to UK Power Networks a few days ago and was told it could take anything up to ten days for a reply. I simply mentioned I needed to have our meter moved 11 inches and they were the people I was told to contact. When they get back to me I’ll mention having them move the meter at the same time.

I was hoping overhead cables were far cheaper to move than those underground given how easy they are to access.

You’ll have to excuse my ignorance when it comes to electrics though, as I know hardly anything apart from the basics. I would therefore be grateful if you could help identify what units I have in my cupboard. Below is what I know, or don’t know.

1: Is this the ‘cut out’ you mention? Is this a fuse as it looks to be locked with a metal anti-tamper seal.

2: Isolator? (something I just know was the trip switch)

3: Garage power

4: Main power switch

5: Light power

What is a ‘CU’? Could you please identify it on my photo and tell me what it stands for and does.

Last but not least: Are the ‘tails’ No 7 or No 8: I always thought they were No 8


Thanks again,

Robert

View media item 90205

 

[westie101]

1
Is the cut-out fed directly from the DNO network

2
Is the isolator, it is purely a switch supplied by the DNO.
The cables going into the top are the DNO's?supplier's and are sealed to prevent tampering.
The cables going from the bottom are yours so those terminals are unsealed to allow you/your electrician access

3,4 & 5 are your existing CU's (forum shorthand for Consumer Unit where all the fuses/circuit breakers for individual circuits in your house are, these are what an electrician will change to a single modern unit.

6
are "Henley" (a generic term) connector blocks

7
These are tails. in your case all cables connecting the cut-out, the meter the isolator and the consumer units.
Ownership as stated

8 look like circuits going out of the two CUs

 

[ban-all-sheds]

1. Yes.

2. Looks like an RCD. Could be used temporarily as an isolator, but the wall it's on is going, so it will go too, and you can't really have a single RCD up-front of an entire installation these days.

3, 4 & 5 are fuseboxes, their function is to protect the individual circuits, nowadays done by a Consumer Unit with MCBs (Miniature Circuit Breakers) instead of fuses.

The tails are 7, and the similar cables running in and out of 6, which is a service connector block, often called a Henley block (in much the same way that vacuum cleaners are often called Hoovers, hot-tubs are Jacuzzis, inline skates are Rollerblades etc etc).


[EDIT]Stupidly malformed links corrected.[/EDIT]

 

[ban-all-sheds]

2 Is the isolator, it is purely a switch supplied by the DNO.

My money is on it being a 100mA RCD, as he has a TT supply.

 

[westie101]

My money is on it being a 100mA RCD

On second sight I agree, but can still be used to isolate the existing switchgear to get it moved I would think

 

[RobertBM]

1
Is the cut-out fed directly from the DNO network

2
Is the isolator, it is purely a switch supplied by the DNO.
The cables going into the top are the DNO's?supplier's and are sealed to prevent tampering.
The cables going from the bottom are yours so those terminals are unsealed to allow you/your electrician access

3,4 & 5 are your existing CU's (forum shorthand for Consumer Unit where all the fuses/circuit breakers for individual circuits in your house are, these are what an electrician will change to a single modern unit.

6
are "Henley" (a generic term) connector blocks

7
These are tails. in your case all cables connecting the cut-out, the meter the isolator and the consumer units.
Ownership as stated

8 look like circuits going out of the two CUs

I’m pleased to say it all seems to be coming together in my head now, and all because you’ve taken the time to explain everything to me.

There are just a few questions remaining which I would love to be answered.

Is the isolator still required if the DNO knows the electrician is to install a new CU?

I also guess the cut-out feed is mandatory regardless of what I fit afterwards, given I’m sure one of the electricians ask for an RCD? to be installed before he even started work. Guess they are the same thing?

Changes are that I need to keep both the isolator and the cut-out feed, so I assume they will replace them with newer units as a matter of course?

Many thanks,

Robert

 

[westie101]

It is likely the DNO would instal an isolator anyway, as for the RCD I suspect the new CU would be equipped with the necessary.

It's also worth asking the DNO if they can supply a PME earth when they do the work, this will require the electrician to do the necessary earth bonding upgrade

 

[RobertBM]

It is likely the DNO would instal an isolator anyway, as for the RCD I suspect the new CU would be equipped with the necessary.

It's also worth asking the DNO if they can supply a PME earth when they do the work, this will require the electrician to do the necessary earth bonding upgrade

Well that has all been a great help, so many thanks for all the advice. I can at least now venture into this knowing a lot more than I did beforehand and won’t sound like a complete novice.

I will of course send you ‘thanks’ but it’s a shame they don’t have a ‘send a drink’ button linked to Paypal so you can have one on me, because you well deserve one.. . .cheers!

Many thanks,

 

[EFLImpudence]

Do you honestly think people would know what you really meant from? -

I’m looking to turn our electricity meter (inside) 90 degrees and move it 11 inches, which doesn’t effect the supply cable in the loft but means the wall it comes down on will be demolished. Anyone know if I’d need to call in the big network guys to secure it to a the new wall, or would the new meter installer not worry too much about it? Just to clarify the supply cables will still exit from the ceiling from more or less the same place give it an inch or two. Also, would the meter installer be willing to shorten the supply cable so the meter could be higher up the wall?

To which Bernard's reply was completely correct.