The Telegraph's Central Heating "Expert" - controv

[BTC]

Article here

Summary of his recommendations:-

* Run the heating continuously during cold spells
* Always run the hot water continuously
* Heat all your rooms - leaving rooms unheated doesn't save money overall as it risks condensation damage and can lower the overall efficiency of condensing boilers
* Turn your boiler output down until your hot water drops below 60 degrees, then leave set it one notch above this (aiming for 70 degrees boiler output)
* TRVs are a nuisance and should be left fully open - steady heat is better to improve condensing boiler efficiency

Agree with him? Absolute rubbish? Discuss!

To be fair to him some of his arguments were based on total cost to home-owner rather than the government's green propaganda that tends to focus on CO2 output only. He is trying to factor in some unintended consequences like damp in unheated rooms.

Edit: the title should end "controversial?" but the forum keeps truncating it for some reason.

 

[izzy eckerslike]

Run the hot water and heating continuously? does he think we're all rich like him or what

That would ramp up my gas bill no end as we have the water on for just 20 minutes a day in two 10 minute slots 12 hrs apart which keeps it piping hot, couldn't do that with my previous boiler and 1950's cylinder though

 

[Kev F]

depends what system you have, if you have a well insulated cylinder ie unvented it will be fine on 24hrs as they lose around 1 degree of heat over 24 hours so as long as your not using the water the boiler wont fire. As for the heating again run it all day at say 20 degrees but id definately use the trvs, dont agree at all with turning them up full, trvs commonly set to 3 downstairs and 2-3 upstairs should be fine.

 

[ajrobb]

"Condensing boilers only really condense properly (thus extracting the waste heat from the flue gases) at a water return temperature of 54°C to 56°C. This is usually achieved by having a flow temperature (that is, the water flowing out of the boiler) of around 70°C."

Boiler manuals often state increased output (i.e. improved efficiency) at very low temperatures. At 70°C flow and 55°C, there is going to be practically no condensing saving.

"As the water flows through the radiators it gives up its heat to the rooms, thus returning to the boiler at a lower temperature. TRVs (thermostatic radiator valves) cause no end of problems, so I advise leaving them fully open."

Tosh. IF the boiler is correctly sized, it will be able to modulate down to match the heat requirement of the house with TRVs active and a room 'stat. Unfortunately, correctly sized boilers are not commonly available.

 

[silverback18]

These so called experts pee me off, this is simply his PERSONAL opinion, others may disagree with him, but where are the results from the extensive testing he has done to state that this is the most efficient way to run a system, I would guess there were no tests, so what are these statements based on, absolutely nothing I would think, total drivel.

 

[Onetap]

Agree with him? Absolute rubbish? Discuss!

Utter rubbish, he is described as a builder elsewhere on the Telegraph website and, like most builders, he know very little about heating. It is a shame that the Telegraph's editor hasn't realized that and stopped the self-indulgent pontificating all over his newspaper.

Disable TRVs? Run all the rooms at 25 or 28 degC or whatever the heating can get them up to? Drivel.

Run the heating 24/7? Nonsense; a programmable thermostat and night setback will do nicely. Reduced running costs and no noticeable difference.

 

[DP]

Unfortunately, correctly sized boilers are not commonly available.

Is it not a case od setting a boiler for the load connected to it instead of sourcing a boiler that matches the heat load ( rare beast indeed). All boilers are self modulating be it 'rushing' to reach the boilerstat setting and then cruising or set boiler to match the lead and then let the controls set the pace.

 

[ajrobb]

Unfortunately, correctly sized boilers are not commonly available.

Is it not a case od setting a boiler for the load connected to it instead of sourcing a boiler that matches the heat load ( rare beast indeed). All boilers are self modulating be it 'rushing' to reach the boilerstat setting and then cruising or set boiler to match the lead and then let the controls set the pace.

Sadly, few boilers can modulate down to the heating load needed for the average new build (76m²) - probably about 3kW.

 

[ianniann]

This is the same guy that says you should never get cavity wall insulation, right? And that PVC windows will only last 10 years or so, while wood will easily do 100 years? He's a total prat and a snob to boot, but then he does write for a particular audience ...

BTW, my moderately large house is sized for a heating need in very cold weather of 7kW, although I'm glad I had more than that just recently. It needs less than 2kW most of the year to maintain a steady temperature. Very few boilers will modulate down anywhere near that, or even to a level that could operate continuously just for the time I'm in the house. Partly that's 'cos I have a big fat combi

 

[simond]

I always enjoy his column myself.

It is the fat bint on the opposite column that writes cobblers IMO.

 

[ianniann]

It isn't so much a question of whether you enjoy the column, Simon, but more of whether he is talking crap I could point out half a dozen people who continuously spout complete BS, but are nevertheless enjoyable to listen to. Change a couple of words and these articles could be a parody, but I really don't think he has that in mind.

Jeff Howell comes up with issues where there is a just a grain of something to rebel against (mandated condensing boilers, TRVs, rare issues with condensation), and then heads off further and further from the land of reason. And sometimes he just makes stuff up to rant about. Where is this government propaganda about not heating certain rooms? Did some BG guy really say to run your boiler as hot as possible to save gas? Possibly, but probably not. In fact the whole letter was probably made up so he could rant about it.

 

[simond]

Well, I don't think the argument over turning heating on and off versus keeping it on at a temp above the SLH of evaporation has been been proved one way or the other.

And it is true that TRVs will fail at some point by sticking in the off position. Usually a case of 'when' rather than 'if'. DIY Superstore ones and Westherms seem ahead of the pack in this regard.

You can pick an argument with Jeff if you want but I think he has a defensible article in the Telegraph.

 

[Agile]

Whilst I dont read his articles most are apparently written with no significant technical understanding.

A quality newspaper should pick a quality writer. Unfortunately he is not one of them. He would be better with the News of the World or whichever paper ran a story of a WWII bomber on the moon!