Wind Turbine to also heat my house?

[200rrr]

All,

I am about to start my construction plans for a 2300sqft 2 storey house in a rural location and also have plans for a 6Kw wind turbine.

I was starting to wonder if I will be able to rely on the turbine energy to heat the house and for hot water via for example an electric boiler. I dont see the point in getting oil or wood chips if I can just use the turbine. what do you think?

I would like wet underfloor heating downstairs and radiators upstairs.

thanks folks.

paul

 

[JohnD]

The amount of electricity it gives will be very small. It should be able to heat the hot Water, but at max ouput it will be equivalent to an immersion heater and a kettle, or two electric heaters. Its average output is probably about a third of that. In long, cold winter spells there may be almost no wind.

So it will be handy... but don't bin your plans for a boiler.

 

[Richard C]

I think to rely on 6kw as the only heat source for a 2300 sq/ft of living space is rather optimistic to say the least; you really need to do some energy calculations. For example; the rural property I’m renovating is only around 1500 sq ft & some rough calculations I did indicate it needs around 14kw for the heating alone.

New properties are more heat efficient than mine; it’s an old property but the insulation & glazing has been upgraded. If you really want to go green, there is an awful lot more you can do to raise the efficiency way above the statutory minimum standards but it does make it initially expensive. We do have solar panels which gives us free hot water April through to mid/end October but it’s not much use in the winter & if it hadn’t have already been there, I would never have forked out the £3k+ required to put it in as it would probably take around 10 years to just pay for the installation cost, let alone the maintenance!

Out of interest, a builder friend of mine investigated wind turbines to provide energy for the large property & residential care home he owns; he gave up in the end as he found that residential type turbines just couldn’t deliver enough energy to make it viable & the larger ones will cost all most as much as the house! The same guy also uses wet underfloor heating in all his new properties, upstars as well!

 

[200rrr]

Hi John,

I note your comments. Where the turbine is located in Northern Ireland is very high and there will be good wind all year. I know we cant rely on it for all our energy needs but I would have expected a bigger contribution than what you have said. I was hoping I could just work with electricity to avoid an oil tank and the hassle/ cost of refulling. need to do the sums though.

Richard- thanks. yeah as you say I need to do the sums.

cheers

 

[JohnD]

... I would have expected a bigger contribution than what you have said.

Turbine = 6kW flat out

Immersion heater 3kW

Washing machine 3kW

Kettle 2.5kW

Do the sums.

 

[Paul Barker]

If initial outlay is not a problem for you then your ultimate is groundsource heatpump, providing underfloor heating (because it takes less power to satisfy you for warmth due to the improved <over radiators> method), powered by your windmill. In that way you will get 18kw of heat out of your 6kw.

Solar panels for hot water.

Get a jcb in and dig some ground up lay your 50mm upanor pipe to collect the heat from the ground, buy your heat pump approx £3k5 (grants may apply), install you underfloor heating.

Cost of a groundsource heatpump system alone Worcester estimate to cost fully installed £12k, but they sell the main body of it, for £3k5 do it yourself save a small fortune.

If you are a heath robinson type of person, the pump hasn't got a lot in it so it shouldn't cost £3k5. You could probably buy all the requisite parts from other industries and assemble something that works for much less. All that Worcester are is an assembly plant.

 

[serge33]

a wind turbine is really only a use to offset your consumption, if i was in your shoes, and i wish i was as i have dreams of doing what you are doing i would use a combination of ways to heat and generate your house hold needs, Hot tap water i would use solar heating, these are rather good, eletricity i would use a wind turbine and drip feed it back into the national grid, so you recoup your money when you need the supply, Have you also considered using wood pellet burning stoves/boilers in your new build?? they burn small pellets a bit like cattle feed in size and can provide all the water heating needed in a house, certainly in a well insulated new/renovation build. there are lots of grants available and alot of the unnits are automatic hopper units, you just need a dry place to store the pellets, which the hopper can take in using a feed screw, and they burn so cleanly that some only need the ash tray cleaning once a month! the pellets can be delivered in a tanker form and are blown into your storage hopper under pressered air!

a combo of these three will see you with a plentyful supply and a back up in cold weather and something that you can control, elctricity is really a combo of how low you can drop your usage and what you can sell to the national grid, almost impossible to be self relient without massive battery banks.

 

[Paul Barker]

Captain Maurice Seddon, though admittedly and eccentric, used sound renewable energy principles many years ago when I visited his house as a despatch rider (he sold electrically heated clothing).

He had wind power on low voltage and used large storage batteries that are serviceable I believe it was a saline system but I might be wrong. You plugged in your electrically heated suit wherever you went in the house. He put polystryrene over the bath to preserve the heat consumed for as long as possible afterwards.

If you have the will, you can make good out of your little, but are you that interested that you don't mind apearing eccentric to the rest of the world as it rushes bye.

 

[Paul Barker]

Don't think this article mensions his wind terbine but he was documented on TV back in the '80's. Eccentric but way in front of the manufacturer bandwaggoners trying to sell ecology for massive profits.

http://www.ltv-vwc.org.uk/wheelspin/ws_june_2003/Captain_maurice_seddon.htm

 

[didthathurt]

I remember researching this about 6 years ago. The suggested way then was to use a turbine to charge up secondhand fork lift truck/milkfloat batteries (they're retired way before they lose that much capacity because they can no longer handle the power del requirements of motive power). This si the inverted and transformed to supply power. It was rumoured that a small house could live off grid totally like this.

Also, what about using hot air circulation from a conservatory heat trap?

Good luck.

 

[JohnD]

... It was rumoured that a small house could live off grid totally like this...

There's a lot of wishful thinking about.

 

[200rrr]

thanks all.

I am looking into the heat pump and turbine combo. I have looked into the wood pellets and it seemed good value as the grants in NI are good, but love the idea of being self sufficient.

will let you know how it goes.

Paul

 

[plugwash]

a house can live off grid with turbines or panels (or prefferablly both) and batteries (and possiblly occasional useage of a generator) but it requires a radically different approach to power usage.

the big thing is heat, you'd need a bloody big turbine to run even a heat pump effectively and solar heating doesn't work too well in winter. burning wood can be a good soloution if you have enough land (large estates with woods on them tend to produce a lot of branches etc which can be burned for heat)

the second thing is efficiancy, people don't realise just how cheap grid power is until they try and build the infrastructure to live without it. choosing lighting and appliances based primerally on efficiancy is vital if you intend to successfully live off grid.

 

[Paul Barker]

When we started out in the expensive south east as dinks we stretched to the limit to buy a two up two down with just an open fire. We scavanged offcuts from the local woodyard they let us take whatever we wanted. I remember the inlaws being conscerned we might get a chimney fire.

There was then and is now a problem in towns geting rid of wooden pallets. My favourite plumbers merchants could supply me with as many wooden pallets as I would take.

It would be interesting to do the maths on a machine that turns the wood into chips for fule.

The Yorkshire saying of cut your own wood and you'll warm yourself twice is oh so true I have proved it many times. It does you no harm to warm yourself in the process of making fire.

Older style (I believe common rail injector pump, very costly, is damaged mortally by what follows) Diesel engines thrive on used cooking oil (once they are warm). There is no duty to pay if you use it off road, it can be purchased from collectors, or you could set up your own collection round. Go and buy and old diesel vehicle, pipe the coolant round your radiators and harnhess the motion with a generator.

 

[oldspark]

thanks all.

I am looking into the heat pump and turbine combo. I have looked into the wood pellets and it seemed good value as the grants in NI are good, but love the idea of being self sufficient.

will let you know how it goes.

Paul

Well any updates on the renewable energy plan ??????