Wrong zone valve actuator/head.

[wobbly2]

Is there any good reason for fitting a 3 port Honeywell zone valve head part no. 40003916-003 on a 2 port Honeywell zone valve (see photo). I believe the 2 port valve should have an actuator/head part no. 40003916-001 fitted.

It would appear the only time the valve closes with this actuator/head fitted is after the power to the system has been removed then switched back on with no HW demand. Once HW demand has been called for the actuator remains energised (i.e. gets and stays hot all the time even with cold pipes) and the valve is either open or partially open regardless of whether there is HW demand or not. Consequently the HW heating never turns off if the CH is on.

If I change the actuator/head I am concerned that the system wiring may have been modified to accommodate the wrong valve head and a simple head change and like for like wiring swap may cause problems; your thoughts on this will be much appreciated. I have a photo of the wiring centre which I can post if required.

The manual lever mechanism appears damaged as the mechanism grinds and slips when manually move so a new actuator/head is likely needed anyway.

If my suspicions are correct I guess Messrs Bodge-it, Collect & Scarper have struck again.

 

[polesapart]

Is there any good reason for fitting a 3 port Honeywell zone valve head part no. 40003916-003 on a 2 port Honeywell zone valve

NO unless laziness, ineptness or "this is all we had on the van" count as good reasons

I guess Messrs Bodge-it, Collect & Scarper have struck again.

YES excuse the shouty caps...but, y'know.

 

[wobbly2]

Am I right in thinking the Honeywell V4043H 2 port valves open from fully closed to fully open through approx 45 degrees of movement of the valve spindle i.e. a quarter turn from fully open to fully closed.

Does a similar bodied Honeywell 3 port valve (V4073??) have the same range of movement i.e. a quarter turn from Port A closed through Mid position to Port B closed. I'm just wondering if the 3 port actuator/head fitted to the 2 port valve could damage the 2 port valve by trying to force it passed its normal fully open and fully closed positions.

 

[Exedon]

I very much doubt wrong head has damaged valve.
Fit correct head post picture of wireing center first!

 

[wobbly2]

First picture is of cable extension to HW zone valve from wiring center. Note white wire from valve (bottom connector) becomes pink wire to wiring center (top connector).

Second picture is wiring center which, as a sparks, I shake my head at.

Getting a better picture of the wire layout will be difficult due to the way they have been crammed into floating connector blocks. The center lid is jammed tight behind the pipework and has to be bent to get it on and off; bloody awful job, no doubt courtesy of Messrs Bodge-it, Collect & Scarper again. Bottom 4 core & E is from HW zone valve fitted with a 3 port valve actuator/head.

 

[ianmcd]

you will have to buy a new 2 port actuator, the good news is they have used a regin socket so wiring will be easy and no need to drain, there is absolutely no way you can just alter wiring to keep using the existing actuator

 

[Madrab]

Second picture is wiring center

Hmmmm kinda .... is that a bare black wire there at the bottom and an exposed N that's marked as a L?

May be an idea to get one of these and tidy all that up

Hmmm

 

[wobbly2]

you will have to buy a new 2 port actuator, the good news is they have used a regin socket so wiring will be easy and no need to drain,

Sorry, I don't see the relevance of the Regin socket to drain(ing).

there is absolutely no way you can just alter wiring to keep using the existing actuator

I don't intend to alter the wiring to keep the existing actuator, I will replace it. I'm just concerned that someone else has tried. The original installer of the wrong head may have done something to the connections to try and get the valve to work, even if only partially, i.e. bodged a bodge.

Side note: Looking at the schematic for the valve head I think its wiring could be modified for 2 port use but that won't help the system owner (my sister) if someone else has to work on it at a later date plus the mechanical workings of the head appear damage anyway.

I don't feel simply connecting the new head by following the wiring colours in the Regin connector from the wiring center will be a good idea. I will trace out the wiring and make sure I understand what is what before doing any changes/replacement.

Hmmmm kinda .... is that a bare black wire there at the bottom and an exposed N that's marked as a L?

Yes and yes, although I have redone the exposed blue wire connection fitted with a phase (L) marker. I didn't have any spare connectors with me at the time so the bare black wire at the bottom is still cut off and un-terminated, which is of course is a breach of the wiring regs but then so is the wiring center generally.

May be an idea to get one of these and tidy all that up

View attachment 321364
Hmmm

This enclosure looks similar to the type already installed which is too wide and results in it being wedged in tight behind the pipe and you have to literally bend its cover around the pipe to get it on or off, dragging the connections about in the process.

The gap between the pipe and the door frame on the right is only about 85mm (single/double socket height) so I'll look for a smaller enclosure. I'd prefer to relocate the wiring center away from the pipework altogether but I doubt there is sufficient length in the cables to do that; as a sparks I don't like running PVC wiring in close proximity to hot pipes even if they are heat resistant.

 

[ianmcd]

Looking at the schematic for the valve head I think its wiring could be modified for 2 port use

No No and Thrice no, you have already been told it cant

Sorry, I don't see the relevance of the Regin socket to drain(ing).

the good news is they have used a regin socket so wiring will be easy

 

[wobbly2]

Job done.

Thanks for the help

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

The gap between the pipe and the door frame on the right is only about 85mm (single/double socket height) so I'll look for a smaller enclosure. I'd prefer to relocate the wiring center away from the pipework altogether but I doubt there is sufficient length in the cables to do that; as a sparks I don't like running PVC wiring in close proximity to hot pipes even if they are heat resistant.

Could you perhaps make a bracket, to be able to mount your wiring centre over the top of the pipes?

 

[wobbly2]

Could you perhaps make a bracket, to be able to mount your wiring centre over the top of the pipes?

That would have been a good idea had I not already replaced the existing wiring centre with a slimmer one. I had to cut the architrave on the inside of the frame away to fit the new box. Your idea would have been better solution using the box suggested above but jobs is done now and all seems OK.

Thanks again for the help