WarWithTurkey
- Thread starter terrypin
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Also, it's debatable whether the Russian fighter actually crossed the Turkish border at all. Russia says it didn't; Turkey and America say it did; and we say what America tells us to say.
Even if it did cross the border, it must only have been for a few seconds and was probably accidental anyway.
And isn't Turkey supposed to be on our side (and Russia's) in combating IZAL? Or perhaps they have other 'alliances'?
The problem now is that they have shot down a Russian fighter and Russia isn't going to be too happy about that. A bigger problem is that Turkey is a member of NATO and any attack on them will bring the rest of us into the conflict.
As far as I'm concerned, the only reason Turkey is a member of NATO is because it provided advanced bases for American forces near to Russia and also formed a 'buffer state' against them. I certainly doubt whose side Turkey is really on. They are definitely unfriendly toward Greece, another NATO member and, after all, are a majority muslim nation, so are not to be trusted.
I think if we are to prevent a possible escalation into a Third World War, Turkey should be kicked out of NATO forthwith. Of course, that would depend on America, as they run the show.
If a conflict between East and West does develop, and if it should risk escalating into a nuclear exchange, aren't you all glad that Corbyn isn't our PM and that we still have Trident and tactical nuclear weapons?
Of course, that will never happen...
will it?
Even if it did cross the border, it must only have been for a few seconds and was probably accidental anyway.
And isn't Turkey supposed to be on our side (and Russia's) in combating IZAL? Or perhaps they have other 'alliances'?
The problem now is that they have shot down a Russian fighter and Russia isn't going to be too happy about that. A bigger problem is that Turkey is a member of NATO and any attack on them will bring the rest of us into the conflict.
As far as I'm concerned, the only reason Turkey is a member of NATO is because it provided advanced bases for American forces near to Russia and also formed a 'buffer state' against them. I certainly doubt whose side Turkey is really on. They are definitely unfriendly toward Greece, another NATO member and, after all, are a majority muslim nation, so are not to be trusted.
I think if we are to prevent a possible escalation into a Third World War, Turkey should be kicked out of NATO forthwith. Of course, that would depend on America, as they run the show.
If a conflict between East and West does develop, and if it should risk escalating into a nuclear exchange, aren't you all glad that Corbyn isn't our PM and that we still have Trident and tactical nuclear weapons?
Of course, that will never happen...
will it?
The evidence seems to suggest it did stray into Turkish air space, but for only something like 15-30 seconds. Ok, they should not have strayed into Turkey's airspace, but Turkey would know full well that the fighter was of no threat to them. So, it begs the question why they did it. If it was to teach Russia a blunt lesson (which I feel it was) - big mistake!!
Russia's always straying into airspaces, so it was bound to happen at some point.
Lot's of noise will be made, putin will use it as an oppertunity to make himself look good (which they need with their economic and military problems of late), but it will be forgotten in a week or two if Turkey does nothing stupid.
Lot's of noise will be made, putin will use it as an oppertunity to make himself look good (which they need with their economic and military problems of late), but it will be forgotten in a week or two if Turkey does nothing stupid.
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If it was done to purely make a point (as stated, the Russians do in fact regularly stray into others airspace) - it was still a stupid move. Even if you forget the aircraft, you don't potentially kill two people to make a point. Imo, Turkey are in the wrong - and no, I don't trust Turkey either.
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If NATO and Russia get into a nuclear conflict, then we in the UK get vaporised. Spain and Portugal won't, Norway and Iceland won't either. France will as they have nuclear weapons. I'm all with Corbyn on this. Get rid of them before we get vaporised.
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I am thinking that whoever gave the order to shoot is now languishing in some Turkish hell-hole. Given the time frame I don't think any consultation took place at a higher level.
But conceivably, it could have come from the top in the form of next time...
Getting old and memory not so good, but did Russia once shoot down a civilian aircraft for straying into its airspace?
But conceivably, it could have come from the top in the form of next time...
Getting old and memory not so good, but did Russia once shoot down a civilian aircraft for straying into its airspace?
I'm sure I heard on the radio that three died and one survived the shooting.
The navigator was extracted and he claims they had no visual or audio warnings.
And I thought you were having a go at me ....
The Russians have been making incursions close to and into other countries airspace and waters for years now. They are deliberately testing the response and the defences. They invaded Crimea using subterfuge, because they thought they could get away with it. Putin is a bully, and flexing his muscles on the world stage. I think you have to stand up to him, without deliberately provoking him. If an aircraft crosses your airspace, it is surely fair game? As far as I know they've been taking liberties for years.
The Russians have been making incursions close to and into other countries airspace and waters for years now. They are deliberately testing the response and the defences. They invaded Crimea using subterfuge, because they thought they could get away with it. Putin is a bully, and flexing his muscles on the world stage. I think you have to stand up to him, without deliberately provoking him. If an aircraft crosses your airspace, it is surely fair game? As far as I know they've been taking liberties for years.
Sod Russia - they fly their bombers where they want anyway.
It's all posturing.
I don't trust Russia, Turkey, the Yanks, or our lot.
Just get on with what you can control.
It's all posturing.
I don't trust Russia, Turkey, the Yanks, or our lot.
Just get on with what you can control.
You are quite correct that they've been taking liberties for years, but as stated, Turkey knew the aircraft was no threat. I don't think it's right to shoot it down to make a point. Maybe at least give Putin a very firm warning that should it happen again, then the aircraft will be shot down. Then, if ignored, he only had himself to blame?
Do you know that they hadn't already?
How many times have Typhoons "escorted" Russia bombers away from Blighty in recent years?
Putin doesn't give a toss for borders, sovereignty, warnings. As WWT said, he's a bully, and will take whatever he can get away with.
If NATO and Russia get into a nuclear conflict, then we in the UK get vaporised. Spain and Portugal won't, Norway and Iceland won't either. France will as they have nuclear weapons. I'm all with Corbyn on this. Get rid of them before we get vaporised.
I've always been confused on this point, so if you don't have nuclear weapons and your neighbour does and they are involved in being 'vapourised' does that mean the fallout from this vapourisation knows to stop at the non-nuclear country's borders then. Clever stuff this nuclear.
I've always been confused on this point, so if you don't have nuclear weapons and your neighbour does and they are involved in being 'vapourised' does that mean the fallout from this vapourisation knows to stop at the non-nuclear country's borders then. Clever stuff this nuclear.
At least they escorted them away and did not shoot them down!
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