removable supports?

[benwwatson]

Hi, I'm currently trying to board out some of my loft after being dropped in it by some shoddy builders... I have 2 thin maybe 2*3 beams which go the full length of my roof... One of which was cut in half to allow a loft hatch to be installed... The problem I have is that they aee bedded into the wall on either end... What do they support and can I remove them

I can get a better pix if this is no good... Thanks

Ben

Untitled

• benwwatson
• 3 Jan 2012
• 1

Untitled

• benwwatson
• 3 Jan 2012
• 1

Untitled

• benwwatson
• 3 Jan 2012
• 1

 

[ladylola]

They are summer beams and they support and give ridgity to your ceiling joists and shouldn't really be removed. Better to lay more timbers on top of the joists in the same direction and height as the beams and then board your loft .Fix them to the wall with hangers too.
Remember us chippies don't just nail timbers onto a roof for the fun of it, if a timber is there it's 99 times out of a 100 there for a very good reason.

 

[benwwatson]

Ah bugger, see now when they put the new hatch in they cut one of those to make a big gap, they then put some boards down on top of the joists(? I'm still unsure on the whole difference between trusses n joists etc)... So now these summer beams stick up like sore thumbs... I wouldn't of minded if they were in straight so I could cut the boards flush to them

And thanks

 

[benwwatson]

As I'm only using the loft space as storage, should I just try to board up to the summer beams and just make do...

Also some of my loft boards over hang by quite a way, am I best to cut the floor bores to size or cut some 2*4 to put in between the joists for support

 

[ladylola]

To be honest I'd still say to go with getting the boards up to the top of the summer beams at least. I can't quite see the size of the joist but they are likely to be around 75mm or 3" in old money. If you board on top of these your insulation will only be 3" whereas to the top of the summer beams will give you 6" which is better but still short of the recommendations. Also it will be stronger as we all start out with the best of intentions only to put light stuff up there but often at some point end up with something like a car engine or anvil hanging like the , er car engine of Damacles above us

 

[masona]

Called ceiling binders down our way

 

[tim00]

FWIW, i'm with masona on the terminology: i've always called them binders (or strongbacks was the more traditional name.)

Summer beams are below the joisting and were traditionally used in traditional timber frame structures.

 

[JohnD]

well they look to me to be very loosely poked into the brickwork. I would be thinking about packing them round with mortar.

If you put counterbattens (say, 2"x3" to match) across the ceiling timbers, they will spread the load of the loft flooring, and will give to space for extra insulation.

you need noggins under any unsupported short ends of the flooring. I prefer ply to chipboard.

 

[ladylola]

Masona you could very well be right about the name, it's just a term I was taught yonks ago.
Funnily enough the names of timbers has caused confusion before. On one job the spec said to replace the puncheon which required us to look up exactly what the architect was refering to. It's a short post acting as an intermediate support to a purlin.
On another occasion working on an old timber frame building that was built with a large dragon beam the painter asked us why it was so called. He'd just brought a lizard he called his dragon hence his interest. A little stumped I looked in up on t' interweb. Shortly after a party was being shown around and one of them asked the same question of the tour guide. She was also stumped and looked over where at I was able to come up with the answer and sound dead smart , evidently it's a corruption of dragging beam , a sort of brace acting in tension rather than compression.

 

[masona]

Summer beams are below the joisting and were traditionally used in traditional timber frame structures.

And if supported on posts below the summerbeam which is known as breastsummer, I'm still learning!

 

[ladylola]

I'm still learning!

aren't we all , every day a school day and all that,
and I must be as bad at anatomy as building because I'm sure someone said I don't know my arse from my elbow