Grounding an Appliance

[akwexavante]

Hoping someone can offer a little advice.

I'm going to be buying a pro mobile router (Teltonika RUTX11 router with a Poynting OMNI-402 Antenna) shortly, and it's primary use is a mobile one such as in a vehicle such as a coach, bus, tram, boat or train etc.

It has a metal casing with a grounding screw. This'll be for earthing the case in a mobile vehicle.

There will be a serious external high gain antenna plugged into it sited high on a gable end wall in a rural location. The power will be provided by a 240V 3 pin plug transformer that will provide an output of 12v DC to the router.

Used in a domestic home will this grounding screw require earthing either to ground or into the mains service wiring.

 

[securespark]

Have you got any pictures or links?

Is the stuff you are buying new?

 

[akwexavante]

PSU: https://teltonika-networks.com/product/uk-power-supply-18w/

Mobile Router: https://www.broadbandbuyer.com/prod...MI26fc0sGo7wIVVe7tCh1XEgtpEAQYBCABEgJTgPD_BwE

Antenna: https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-antenna-omni-402

I'm buying new.

 

[JohnW2]

There will be a serious external high gain antenna plugged into it ...

I'm somewhat struggling to understand how an omni-directional antenna can be "('serious') high gain". Am I missing something?

Kind Regards, John

 

[akwexavante]

I'm not this technically minded... "

"I'm somewhat struggling to understand how an omni-directional antenna can be "('serious') high gain". Am I missing something?" I've been told by the seller that this antenna is a serious bit of kit with high gain?

I'm not a radio expert at all whatsoever and don't understand anything re radio etc.

Just trying to find a solution to a problem and make sure i install something that's safe and legal to use.

Rural 200+ yr old house with 2 to 3ft thick walls miles away from nowhere with no phone line. In need of a solution to get fast reliable broadband into the house. I'm told satellite broadband is unreliable at best.

standing outside the house i get a full signal on my mobile, standing inside the house i get nada, nothing at all anywhere.

The house does benefit from 3x 4G mobile broadband masts in direct line of sight between 2 and 4 miles away spread out across roughly a 60 degree angle across a valley.

I'm handy but i'm not an electrician nor do i have any knowledge about radio equipment etc.

 

[securespark]

Used in a domestic home will this grounding screw require earthing either to ground or into the mains service wiring.

If the PSU required earthing, it would be earthed internally via the mains connection. I would think the earthing screw would be to connect other metalwork to the earth connection of the mains supply.

But, you really need to read the instructions or contact the sellers for advice.

 

[JohnW2]

I'm not a radio expert at all whatsoever and don't understand anything re radio etc. .... Just trying to find a solution to a problem and make sure i install something that's safe and legal to use.

A truly 'omni-directional' antenna (as, for example, one has to have on, say, a moving vehicle) has no 'gain' at all. Once achieves 'gain', compared with that, by making it more 'directional' - to get very high gain (and a very high degree of directionality) one needs either a long multi-element antenna (like some TV ones you'll see around) or a dish (as used for Sky/satellite).

Rural 200+ yr old house with 2 to 3ft thick walls miles away from nowhere with no phone line. In need of a solution to get fast reliable broadband into the house. I'm told satellite broadband is unreliable at best. ... standing outside the house i get a full signal on my mobile, standing inside the house i get nada, nothing at all anywhere.

Very similar here, particularly the mobile signal!

Where will your broadband connection be coming from? Mine comes from a line-of-sight mast on a hilltop a couple of miles away, and I have a small (genuinely!) high-gain dish (about 30cm diameter) mounted on a chimney. I also have a bog-standard cheap router - nothing 'fancy and expensive' such as you propose.

Kind Regards, John

 

[bernardgreen]

Co-linear antenna can have gain and be omni-directional

 

[winston1]

I'm somewhat struggling to understand how an omni-directional antenna can be "('serious') high gain". Am I missing something?

Kind Regards, John

If you stack vertical dipoles one above the other in phase you can have gain and omnidirectional. "('serious') high gain" I guess is subjective.
Then there is the slim jim aerial.

 

[akwexavante]

Thank you John,

What is your setup in a little more detail please?

What router and dish are you using? Is the dish plugged directly into a mobile router (integral modem) or is it plugged into a mobile modem that then plugs into a router?

Just how tight is a directional antenna / dish. I have 3x 4G masts to choose from, all in direct line of sight across a valley between 2 and 4 miles away spread out over an angle that's roughly 60 degrees. Vodafone and EE are using all 3 of them.

My simplistic knowledge of these things goes as far as i think a directional antenna picks up a signal from just one mast and if that mast falls over, disappears, gets moved or goes offline then you're stuffed. As i understand things a omni directional antenna has less gain but does not depend on just one mast but can switch which mast it uses depending on whichever masts can be found with the strongest signal.

Just how tight does a directional antenna / dish need to be lined up to a mast? Can it be lined up to a number of different masts within an angle of say 60 degrees so that it can choose which mast is best?

 

[JohnW2]

If you stack vertical dipoles one above the other in phase you can have gain and omnidirectional. "('serious') high gain" I guess is subjective.

That is still making them more 'directional', by reducing the vertical beam width.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Thank you John, What is your setup in a little more detail please?

Before I attempt to answer the rest of your questions, can you clarify (as I asked) where you are planning to get your internet connection from? From what you've said, it sounds as if you are talking about connecting to a mobile phone network and using that for your internet connection - is that the case?

Mine comes from a local dedicated 'wireless internet' provider (quite common in rural areas like ours) and does not involve any mobile phone network.

Kind Regards, John

 

[akwexavante]

Thank you John,

There is no "Wireless Internet" sometimes i believe called radio broadband available in my area.

I will only have either satellite broadband or Mobile Broadband, using mobile phone technology basically.

Mobile phone data SIM into a mobile broadband router (integral Modem) connected to an external antenna or dish.

There are 3x 4G mobile phone masts to choose from ranging from 2 to 4 miles away all in direct line of sight, all used by both Vodafone and EE and they are spread out over a 60 degree angle

 

[JohnW2]

Thank you John, There is no "Wireless Internet" sometimes i believe called radio broadband available in my area.

OK. You're not as lucky as me, then.

I will only have either satellite broadband or Mobile Broadband, using mobile phone technology basically. ... Mobile phone data SIM into a mobile broadband router (integral Modem) connected to an external antenna or dish.

Fair enough. That's not something I'm familiar with - i.e. I've never had reason to try to connect a router (for internet connection) directly to a mobile phone network - but you seem to know about ways of doing that.

However, in your initial message, you said "standing outside the house i get a full signal on my mobile, standing inside the house i get nada, nothing at all anywhere." (which is much the same as my situation here - there are a few places, close to windows, where I sometimes get a mobile signal indoors!).

If that's the case, then it doesn't sound as if you need anything 'high gain' (nor a line-of-sight to a mobile mast) - it sounds as if you merely need to 'extend' the mobile network connection through the walls of your house, and any antenna outside your house should (just like your phone) get an adequate connection (to whichever mast it chose to select) - so no need to worry about any 'directionality' issues such as you asked about when you wrote:

My simplistic knowledge of these things goes as far as i think a directional antenna picks up a signal from just one mast and if that mast falls over, disappears, gets moved or goes offline then you're stuffed. As i understand things a omni directional antenna has less gain but does not depend on just one mast but can switch which mast it uses depending on whichever masts can be found with the strongest signal.

I'm not sure what 'mobile signal extenders' are available, but I'm sure there must be some around.

Kind Regards, John

 

[akwexavante]

Found all sorts of extenders and boosters but non that tick all my boxes. Most pickup a signal from a window sill antenna and then provide a WiFi signal to connect devices to.

I will have 2 desktop PC's requiring ethernet connections and a ethernet based CCTV system, 2x TV's to connect up via ethernet cables etc.

So several ethernet ports are required and the vast majority of boosters / extenders don't provide this.

Hence the need for something more such as a teltonika RUTX11 mobile router, there are others to choose from. Ethernet ports and WiFi. It's quite possible that i won't get WiFi far from the room where the router will be because of the thickness of the internal walls so i'll need to run ethernet cables around the house to get stuff connected up or add WiFi to different rooms via additional access points on the end of ethernet cables.