Zia Yusuf (Reform Chairman) resigns

[JohnD]

Every day the news tells us that Reform have won more elections and that more MPs have defected to it.

What election did they win yesterday?

 

[festive]

In a way this links to my point about if Reform become the next government, or the one after that.

Trust me, it will be a continuation of the same guff, the same lack of delivery, the same excuses getting rolled out by their MPs on QT, the same excuses by the cabinet in parliament, the same excuses by Nige at PMQs.

It'll be same sh1t, different party.

Agree it will be mostly. Why?

Because the 'opposition' will be doing just that, opposing and blocking anything and everything to discredit the political party in power at that time. It is beyond fkced up. I say it time n time again when would you ever run a business like we run our country, for all the idiocies Trump has at least he is trying to run the USA as a business.

Right now:

• Whips effectively coerce MPs to vote the party line, even when their constituents or personal principles disagree. Entirely ****ed up.
• Opposition parties often automatically oppose everything, not because it’s bad policy but because it’s politically convenient. Entirely ****ed up.
• MPs are supposed to represent constituencies, but in reality many represent party HQ.

What should change:

Swearing-in oath explicitly stating “Nation before Party” , this would create a constitutional expectation.
Make MPs legally bound to declare when voting against their constituency’s interest, this forces transparency.
Limit or ban punitive measures for rebelling MPs this encourages independent voting removing the Whip effect.
Require public justification from opposition when voting against policy, this stops the idiotic knee-jerk obstruction.

---

 

[Notch7]

and that more MPs have defected to it.

Tory MPs

Reform are just the Tory party

people who are supporting Reform because they think they are voting for change need to pay attention

 

[Notch7]

Make MPs legally bound to declare when voting against their constituency’s interest, this forces transparency

after 2016 MPs largely voted against brexit because it would be bad for their constituencies

people like Festive were screaming MPs were acting "against the will of the people"

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Agree it will be mostly. Why?

Because the 'opposition' will be doing just that, opposing and blocking anything and everything to discredit the political party in power at that time. It is beyond fkced up. I say it time n time again when would you ever run a business like we run our country, for all the idiocies Trump has at least he is trying to run the USA as a business.

Right now:

• Whips effectively coerce MPs to vote the party line, even when their constituents or personal principles disagree. Entirely ****ed up.
• Opposition parties often automatically oppose everything, not because it’s bad policy but because it’s politically convenient. Entirely ****ed up.
• MPs are supposed to represent constituencies, but in reality many represent party HQ.

What should change:

Swearing-in oath explicitly stating “Nation before Party” , this would create a constitutional expectation.
Make MPs legally bound to declare when voting against their constituency’s interest, this forces transparency.
Limit or ban punitive measures for rebelling MPs this encourages independent voting removing the Whip effect.
Require public justification from opposition when voting against policy, this stops the idiotic knee-jerk obstruction.

---

The problem really is we have 2 different sides (left and right) that want different things and see the opposition as more important than what the "for" side want.

We used to be a much less divided, more balanced society, where the opposition still happened but in a much less extremely divided way. The difference now being a very weak centre ground.

All of our politics is based on power, those in charge have it, to a differing level depending on the size of their majority. It's this that needs addressing, move away from the confrontational politics. A lot of the countries that have a coalition and have to work with their opponents tend to get a more balanced approach overall (it's still not without problems).

But we, as a nation, are trained to always blame "the others" and not take responsibility.

PR is the only way forward imo. And if that gives us coalition, hampered, government then so be it. It would soon (a few years) begin to change and make politicians of all sides look for compromise not conflict.

 

[Notch7]

Whips effectively coerce MPs to vote the party line, even when their constituents or personal principles disagree. Entirely ****ed up.

Ah so you support MPs right to have voted against brexit when the party line was to vote for brexit

interesting

 

[festive]

Ah so you support MPs right to have voted against brexit when the party line was to vote for brexit

interesting

You just can't ever in your sad lonely existence agree can you, all i am saying is i want whats best for our country not selfish political agenda, you always have to pick holes and or moan about anything possible in our posts, Brexit etc, grow up, get a life go outside and live a little.

OR better still make a positive contribution or are you also just a troll on here 'keeping the traffic on here'

 

[SPLINE]

Because the 'opposition' will be doing just that, opposing and blocking anything and everything to discredit the political party in power at that time.

---

Sorry Festo, this is the "normie" view and it's wrong. There has been no effective opposition for decades; all the big name parties are on the same side - global communism. The most recent Conservative governments, despite their large majorities, did not oppose Labour, they simpy continued the new Labour project. The true opposition are the banned: Tommy Robinson, Katie Hopkins, Rupert Lowe and all the so called far-right parties. It remains to be seen whether Reform will become just another part of the blob.

 

[Notch7]

i am saying is i want whats best for our country

you support Reform

that is not what is best for this country

 

[Notch7]

for all the idiocies Trump has at least he is trying to run the USA as a business.

no he isnt

tariffs -damage business
deportations of undocumented workers -damage business
make America so unpopular that tourism has plummeted -damages business
make America so unpoplular American good are being boycotted

oh and his big beautiful bill is gonna add $3 trillion to the debt

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Sorry Festo, this is the "normie" view and it's wrong. There has been no effective opposition for decades; all the big name parties are on the same side - global communism. The most recent Conservative governments, despite their large majorities, did not oppose Labour, they simpy continued the new Labour project. The true opposition are the banned: Tommy Robinson, Katie Hopkins, Rupert Lowe and all the so called far-right parties. It remains to be seen whether Reform will become just another part of the blob.

What a load of codswallop.
Talking about Tommy Robinson, whats your other name(s)?

 

[carmanmemoranda]

You just can't ever in your sad lonely existence agree can you, all i am saying is i want whats best for our country not selfish political agenda, you always have to pick holes and or moan about anything possible in our posts, Brexit etc, grow up, get a life go outside and live a little.

OR better still make a positive contribution or are you also just a troll on here 'keeping the traffic on here'

Brexit is a great case in point though.

2 sides can't agree because of obvious facts

1 Side has to "win" even if it's at the cost of......... what's best for the country

 

[Brigadier]

Interesting one on Nicky Campbell yesterday.

Substandard Tory councillor had jumped to Reform, to give them the benefit of his "abilities"


A caller said that Reform were a one-issue party, that one issue being immigration.

The councillor disagreed and, when NC asked him for another Reform policy he agreed with, he replied

"Raising the income tax threshold to £20k p.a.", as this would "make work pay" for many of his constituents.


NC asked him how much this policy would cost the UK.

"I don't know", came the reply.

So, you support a slogan with no idea about anything behind it?, said NC.


When NC told him that the policy would cost "between £40 and 90 billion p.a., according to the IFS", he just said "Oh."

 

[carmanmemoranda]

no he isnt

tariffs -damage business
deportations of undocumented workers -damage business
make America so unpopular that tourism has plummeted -damages business
make America so unpoplular American good are being boycotted

oh and his big beautiful bill is gonna add $3 trillion to the debt

Tariffs aren't bringing prices down for the little consumer.

Trump is hurting them most. That's not doing the best for the country (it's people)

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Interesting one on Nicky Campbell yesterday.

Substandard Tory councillor had jumped to Reform, to give them the benefit of his "abilities"


A caller said that Reform were a one-issue party, that one issue being immigration.

The councillor disagreed and, when NC asked him for another Reform policy he agreed with, he replied

"Raising the income tax threshold to £20k p.a.", as this would "make work pay" for many of his constituents.


NC asked him how much this policy would cost the UK.

"I don't know", came the reply.

So, you support a slogan with no idea about anything behind it?, said NC.


When NC told him that the policy would cost "between £40 and 90 billion p.a., according to the IFS", he just said "Oh."

Proves the point about slogans again