Problems with landline / phone - can't hear caller

[Florine]

I'm hoping someone can help me to work this one out. The situation is that there is a 3-way splitter plugged into the BT main box, of which only two sockets are currently in use: one for an answerphone, and the other for the broadband filter, into which are connected the router and the actual traditional landline phone. The person concerned is housebound, and therefore does need to have a properly functioning landline.

For the past couple of weeks, there has been a problem on the landline in that you can't hear the caller, but they can hear you! So you pick up the phone, speak (you hope) to the (inaudible) caller and explain the situation, and maybe ask them to leave a message on the answerphone if necessary so someone can ring them back on a mobile. Usually when you pick up the receiver either to make a call or to receive one, you get nothing but dead air, although occasionally there is an attempt at something approaching a dialling tone - the odd beep or two. We've plugged an old spare phone into the broadband filter instead and that works all right, but it is terribly basic, and doesn't have any features such as caller display, stored phone numbers etc. You can in fact still dial out from the main phone, it's just that you can't hear anything whatsoever at the other end.

(Co?)incidentally, there were some people from BT OpenReach working on the line out in the road a few days before the problem was noticed. We've been in touch with the service provider and they've tested the line and thought the line was okay. So what I'm really trying to work out is to what extent the problem is on the outside line and to what extent it's with the phone and/or connections. There's been no problem until the last few weeks.

Do REN numbers still matter these days? As I say, we have the phone, answerphone and router plugged into the main box. Phones and answerphone are REN 1, but I'm not sure about the router. I was thinking we could plug the spare phone into the spare splitter socket as a temporary measure to enable the caller to be heard, but I don't want to overload the socket - if such a thing is still possible, anyway.

I've replaced the broadband filter without it making any difference. Haven't tried replacing the splitter yet. I'm wondering whether it would be worth trying replacing either the curly cord from the receiver or the cable between the phone and the broadband filter - I can't cannibalise the old phone as it's so old that the parts can't be separated. I suppose it's also possible that it might be the receiver at fault - but then I'd need to find a suitably-shaped replacement so that it fitted the base properly.

Would appreciate any thoughts from someone more familiar with telecoms than me - thanks!

 

[opps]

What happens if you plug the phone into the engineer socket on the NTE5 box?

To do that, you undo the two lower screws on the box, you will then see a another RJ11 socket that you can plug the phone into. Doing so bypasses any extensions.

I guess that you could try that with the coupler as well in the engineer socket.

If a basic phone works, I suspect that, you have a wireless (DECT) phone that is faulty.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Do REN numbers still matter these days? As I say, we have the phone, answerphone and router plugged into the main box. Phones and answerphone are REN 1, but I'm not sure about the router. I was thinking we could plug the spare phone into the spare splitter socket as a temporary measure to enable the caller to be heard, but I don't want to overload the socket - if such a thing is still possible, anyway.

REN, only refers to the number of phones, which the line will be able to make ring, it has nowt to do with speech once answered.

 

[opps]

REN, only refers to the number of phones, which the line will be able to make ring, it has nowt to do with speech once answered.

Yeah, REN- ringer equivalent number. It relates to the the amount of power provided by the phone line and the amount consumed by each device. That said, from memory, the max was 4 REN but a MODEM or answer machine takes their (primary) power from the mains.

You might be able to correct me, but I thought that the biggest REN draw in the old days was the bell ringer in the handset.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Yeah, REN- ringer equivalent number. It relates to the the amount of power provided by the phone line and the amount consumed by each device. That said, from memory, the max was 4 REN but a MODEM or answer machine takes their (primary) power from the mains.

You might be able to correct me, but I thought that the biggest REN draw in the old days was the bell ringer in the handset.

From memory, a standard phone, with mechanical bell, had a REN of 1. The later electronic phones could be a low as 1/4 REN. BT again from memory, would only guarantee your phones would ring, if the total load on the line was below 4.

 

[Diver Fred]

edit:- my reply below is I assumed that the problem is with 'corded' fixed point telephone and not a 'cordless' portable one.

From your comments on what you done to localise the problem my diagnosis of the fault is the housebound persons telephone itself. You say you have changed the 'phone for another and that works OK so that should have told you something. A question, is the instruction book available for the telephone instrument? Is there a volume control on it? Some of the telephone instruments targeted at less able customers have adjustable incoming audio level control (the volume control) which is not always obvious. You could always try another telephone to confirm.

To explain a little on how a phone works - the 'line' between exchange* and house is 2-wire (so what the local and distant person says is carried on that 2-wire circuit). Inside the 'phone that is converted from 2-wire to 4-wire (2-wires for local, outgoing speech, 2-wires for distant, incoming speech). In old style telephones, those with a mechanical bell, the 2-wire to 4 wire conversion was done via, what was effectively, a transformer; in modern, those without a mechanical bell, the 2-wire to 4-wire conversion is done in a semi-conductor chip.
* Or Router if the conversion to 'Digital Voice' has been completed.

 

[flameport]

We've plugged an old spare phone into the broadband filter instead and that works all right,

The phone is broken. Buy a new one.

there were some people from BT OpenReach working on the line

Unrelated.

Do REN numbers still matter these days?

No.

 

[opps]

From memory, a standard phone, with mechanical bell, had a REN of 1. The later electronic phones could be a low as 1/4 REN. BT again from memory, would only guarantee your phones would ring, if the total load on the line was below 4.

These days, don't many houses no longer have the cable used for generating the power for the bell ringer anyway? When I was younger 2,3,5 were the standard. Most sockets I now come across only use two cables (2 and 5?).

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

These days, don't many houses no longer have the cable used for generating the power for the bell ringer anyway? When I was younger 2,3,5 were the standard. Most sockets I now come across only use two cables (2 and 5?).

What I remember, is that the extra wire was needed, to prevent the tinkle on old type phones, when one phone was used to pulse dial a number. It was not a problem, that the later, electronic phones suffered, because they tone dialled, therefore you could get away with just the two wires on later installations.

40+ years ago, when this place was being refurbed/ replastered etc., I ran a 4-pair/8-wire, to every room, including the detached garage/workshop. That was before wireless phones appeared. Only one of those extension sockets is now used, for a 4 phone, DEC wireless base station.

 

[opps]

What I remember, is that the extra wire was needed, to prevent the tinkle on old type phones, when one phone was used to pulse dial a number. It was not a problem, that the later, electronic phones suffered, because they tone dialled, therefore you could get away with just the two wires on later installations.

40+ years ago, when this place was being refurbed/ replastered etc., I ran a 4-pair/8-wire, to every room, including the detached garage/workshop. That was before wireless phones appeared. Only one of those extension sockets is now used, for a 4 phone, DEC wireless base station.

Having just checked, #3 was for the bell ringer in the phone to work. From (my distant) memory, yeah, people used to use #4 as well, that might have been the anti-tinkle one.