A Rated Windows ?

[bob2611]

I have had several companies come round and frankly, I have never met a shadier bunch of people in my life. Talk about snake oil salesmen. Either they are price fantasists or they have "so much work" they don't care what you say, not bother about answering questions and practically grunt a price and ask when to start.

When I ask about Energy ratings, they just go "yeah yeah yeah... we'll give you a rated top the range"

How do you know you are getting A rated windows. I don't see any etchings on the windows to say so and the glass looks the same.

How do you know that you are getting what you paid for ?

 

[Nooz]

What you've had is salesmen, they know little or nothing about what they are selling and by the sounds of it, selling itself!

The windows should come with an energy certificate also they should be ce marked (legal requirement ) which will have the energy rating on it. Ask to see an example and to be honest ask around your friends for recommendations, let other peoples experiences guide you, it will tell you more about the company you are going to deal with.

 

[Nooz]

Sorry not on the ce marking, just checked ours

 

[bob2611]

Thanks for the reply. This is the exactly what I am talking about. They are building the windows themselves and they have blank certificates.

How do you know they are not giving you cheap knock offs and giving you an A rated cert.

 

[Nooz]

An A rated window will typically have a combination of either Planitherm A or Pilkington K ( there are others ), with or without low iron glass. Argon filled units and a warm edge spacer. A lot depends on the profile as to the make up of the glass and not knowing what they are offering I can't help much more.

When they say they make the windows, unless they are a massive firm I doubt very much it will be more than buy the frames from one supplier and the glass from another and put it together. For ce marking if you supply a product you are responsible for marking it, if they are a big company then they would have energy certificates to prove what they did.

I'm not sure I'd like to deal with anyone who was unwilling to prove what they are fitting, it would put me off straight away.
Ask for recommendations, go see others who have recently had replacement windows and see if they are happy with what they have got.

If you have any more info I might be able to help

 

[Gazman16]

To be honest as a customer there is no way of knowing if you were being ripped off. Someone could easily be making C rated windows and putting an A rated sticker on them.

Go for a local company, Preferably recommended by someone you know, Dont worry too much about the spec and sales speil. All the major brand makes are fairly similar and as a home owner you will never notice the difference once their fitted.

It is the fitting that is most important.

Go for a window you like the look of (nice molding etc) and a company you would be happy to have in your house. A small/medium firm will know all their fitters and rely on them to do a good job for the company's reputation.

 

[bob2611]

Thanks so much. Can I ask another question about getting ripped off.

If wickes and others are making A rated windows @ £220 a windows (so I assume that is the cost of these windows) and they can fit them all in one day or two. So lets say £50 per window (being conservative) for fitting.

for 7 windows that's £1890. Lets say £800 for the door (as per yaledoors.com). £2690.

Where are these people coming out with £5k-£7k. I have had this a few times. They get shirty when I say break it down in to parts and labour as they damn well know they are taking the micheal. This whole window buying experience makes me feel like I am buying snake oil.

 

[Gazman16]

Bare in mind the stuff they sell in Wicks is cheap rubbish off a shelf not custom size quality made. Saying that I pay cost price around the same for good quality windows.

Breaking down prices is a pain, Can they charge you extra for the hour or 2 they would have to sit around and do it?

Fitters will have to be paid all year round including holidays.
Mark up
Trims
Fixings
Foam
Silicone
Fuel
Insurance (business, vans, Accidents, Public liability and IBGs)
Fensa registration plus membership fees to other trade body's
Tool maintenance
Van maintenance
VAT
Accountants fees
Receptionist wages
Surveyors wages
Sales man wages
Business rates
Waste disposal and license fees
Storage
Work shop costs
Guaranteed repairs for 10 years
Health and safety
Wastage
Unforeseen problems
Profit?

The smaller the company the less of the above you would be paying towards

 

[bob2611]

Thanks Gazman. I hear what you are saying but I don't expect to pay 3 times what they are worth (and my costs calculation actually include the costs of the fitters). I don't mind anyone making a profit but some just take the p**s.

You are probably right. Find a local guy\small outfit who can fit them who doesn't have all the overheads.

Is the 10 year warranty actually worth anything ? How easy is it to invoke a repair on these things ?

 

[Gazman16]

It depends on the company.
Some will drag things on for months. Some will sort things straight away.

What you will normally find is its ten years on the windows, Glass and fitting but in the small print only one year on moving parts like handles and hinges etc. Thats all pretty standard.

 

[crank39]

Is the 10 year warranty actually worth anything ? How easy is it to invoke a repair on these things ?

Yes, worth every penny and if you ever need to claim you ring the insurer, they check that the installer has definitely ceased trading usually with companies house, send you a claim form and then they'll appoint a repair company(like the one I work for) to attend your property to carry out a brief survey of the fault, I'll then type up a report using lots of long posh words that only insurance companies use and understand and email it to them, they make sure your covered for the fault and then re appoint us to carry out the repair, at no point is there any cost to you, policies cost around £12 so worth having, I believe it is a requirement of Fensa or Certass that the installer can at the very least supply an IBG even if you declined one

 

[crank39]

It depends on the company.
Some will drag things on for months. Some will sort things straight away.

What you will normally find is its ten years on the windows, Glass and fitting but in the small print only one year on moving parts like handles and hinges etc. Thats all pretty standard.

Sun damage is usually declined, warping/bowing/fading etc etc

Other than that frames are covered

Glass units might only be covered for 5 years so check the small print

Handles, hinges and locks (or metallic moving parts) might only be 1 year, again check the small print

Workmanship normally covered for 1 year but can vary

However there are policies out there that cover everything for the full 10 years

 

[Click4]

Just got some windows from a local company Essex Trade Windows.

They manufacture the frames themselves using fully sculptured profile32.

Use safeware sash locks.

And use glass units manufacturerd by solaglass with planitherm total+ Argon filled with warm edge spacer.

All of them have CE stickers and silver sticker with their certificate number stating A rating... All they sell is a rated units.

Quite impressed with them, price wasn't bad either.

So always worth looking around and don't buy through a salesman, deal direct with the manufacturer and compare as you never know what you are buying.

 

[Cabbyfan]

There are certainly benefits of buying local through a smaller firm if you don't mind paying for the installer side of things. My parents had all their windows replaced 15 years ago and 2 years ago some of the panels misted. Parents contacted the guy who installed them, he came over and measured up for new panels, supplied and fitted them for a very reasonable cost.

Personally I am still looking for a supplier of Windows & doors (UPVC) so I can fit them myself as part of a refurb project!

 

[bob2611]

Just got some windows from a local company Essex Trade Windows.

They manufacture the frames themselves using fully sculptured profile32.

Use safeware sash locks.

And use glass units manufacturerd by solaglass with planitherm total+ Argon filled with warm edge spacer.

All of them have CE stickers and silver sticker with their certificate number stating A rating... All they sell is a rated units.

Quite impressed with them, price wasn't bad either.

So always worth looking around and don't buy through a salesman, deal direct with the manufacturer and compare as you never know what you are buying.

Thanks for the tip. I actually have them coming round to give me a quote. They said they use profile 22 and doorstop dooers. How do they compare to others like rehau and doors like rock or veka ?