Amptec 12kw boiler melted incoming cables

[Spark123]

If it does require a 63A breaker then you may be looking at a more industrial strength consumer unit or a switch fuse and an RCD.
Also need to check that the cable is sufficient to handle the current as installed.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

tHE MCB WAS TRIPPING OUT EVERY HOUR SO IT WAS WIRED STRAIGHT INTO THE RCD

Don't ever let the idiot who did that anywhere near your house again

just found on there new site 12kw@240 11kw@230v 50a rating they recommend 63a mcb they could have put this in the hand book reckon they have had problems before now there including the advice on the new spec sheet.

I don't see why they should have had problems - "officially" the device draws 48A, and even at the maximum range of supply voltage of 253V it's less than 53A - too low to cause a B50 to trip. 63A is the next size up, so they might have preferred not to be on the limit, but if they recommend that then that is what you should use.

As spark123 says - check with your CU supplier that a 63A device is supportable, and pay attention to the cable size - 10mm² might be OK for 63A, depending on how it's installed, but 16mm² could easily be required. You'd hope that they would understand that, and make their terminals capable of accepting 16mm²...

I can't see how your PCB overheating fault could be due to a faulty MCB, or to the use of 10mm² when 16mm² was needed. The latter would cause the cable to overheat, but not to the extent that it would melt solder and cause plastics to bubble.

 

[mrrigidtool]

this is what they sent and it is how i will fit //www.diynot.com/network/mrrigidtool/albums/

purchased a merlin 60a mcb

merlin 80a 6cd

merlin 100a dp switch with seperate box and 10mm heat resistant wire also two heat fire alarm sensors to add on to my alarm panel 1 near the heater and one near the main head, not going to try the 16mm again as it has to be forced into the connectors and they are rated to a max of 10mm on the book, i will then meter it on full power and if it's drawing more then it's rated for at 240v then i will switch off and take legal advice

 

[Spark123]

For your own safety please contact a competent electrician who can come and take a look at the installation; http://www.competentperson.co.uk/search.asp

 

[RF Lighting]

You havent yet mentioned a double pole isolator local to the water heater.

You do have one installed don't you?

I expect the terminals were not done up properly when it was first installed.

The loose connection will have done untold heat damage to the terminals and the cable.

You really need to get an electrician to take a look.

The idiot who has previously had a look is so far from being an electrician it makes me shudder.

 

[gas4you]

Heatrae did have a well documented problem with pcb's on these boilers at around the time you had this fitted.

I can't remember it causing this type of fault though

 

[ban-all-sheds]

this is what they sent and it is how i will fit //www.diynot.com/network/mrrigidtool/albums/[/QUOTE]
Too many out of focus snaps - can't make out what you're supposed to be showing us.

purchased a merlin 60a mcb

They said to use a 63A...

not going to try the 16mm again as it has to be forced into the connectors and they are rated to a max of 10mm on the book

They are so having a laugh.

They tell you to use a 63A MCB, and then they design a product which will not take the size of cable that you could well need to be able to put it on a 63A MCB. The size of cable you should use for any application is determined by a number of factors, but one of them is that it must be capable of carrying at least the current at which the protective device is rated, i.e. in this case 63A. Even if you installed a dedicated circuit to run a 10w night light, if you put it on a 63A MCB the cable must be rated for at least 63A.

http://www.kevinboone.com/cableselection_web.html

10mm² is only capable of carrying 63A in free air, or on a cable tray, or clipped to the surface of a wall, or buried directly into a plastered wall. Introduce any hint of thermal insulation, or conduit, or being grouped with other cables, or running through an area which gets hot, and it will not suffice.

 

[mrrigidtool]

not getting anymore electricians will rig it up exactly as they have asked for including 60a mcb a rcd double pole switch locale to boiler and 10mm heat resistent cable that i got today, will through away the volex ****e he installed and replace with merlin. Should have done it myself to start with as i would have contacted them for clarification and researched it first unlike mr so called sparky. Had to do an electrical installation module to gain my NVQ2 also have an A level in electronics and Physics i only got him in as i was to busy re plumbing the new bath room and durect cylinder with my new 6bar pump. Once its on tomorrow will meter it and if its not drawing more current then it should i will only conclude that the connector was not soldered on properly or dry joint, as terminals were tight as when i asked him to up it to 16mm he was having trouble bending them in so i came down and screwed them in as he forced the cable in and could only get a few turns on the screw. i did question the fact that he never wired it through a dp switch however he said that becuase the rcd was withen hands reach of the boiler it was excepable to omit it.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

not getting anymore electricians

What will you do about notification?

will rig it up exactly as they have asked for including 60a mcb

just found on there new site 12kw@240 11kw@230v 50a rating they recommend 63a mcb

a rcd double pole switch locale to boiler and 10mm heat resistent cable that i got today,

What type of cable is it?

Which installation method will you use for it?

At what current is it rated with that installation method at 70°C?

i did question the fact that he never wired it through a dp switch however he said that becuase the rcd was withen hands reach of the boiler it was excepable to omit it.

He was correct.

 

[mrrigidtool]

got ho7rn-f 3 core 10mm from batt cable was also told that 60amcb will handle upto 63a and the fact that it should only draw just above 50 should be ok. will fire it up tom and test it, don't think electrician was too bad however i know from my corgi training to always follow manufactures instruction when it comes to installation and when in doubt email them and get it confirmed in writing.

 

[Agile]

Its interesting to me that no mention has been made of the typical mains voltage measured at this property!

I also expect that the problem has been that the terminals have not been adequately tightened at the terminals. But I also agree that those supplied by many manufacturers seem to be totally undersized!

Soldering the conductors together at the termination always seems to me to give better and more reliable operation. Has anyone else had the same experience?

Tony

 

[mrrigidtool]

thanks for the tip will tin the tips of the wires

 

[Spark123]

Too many out of focus snaps - can't make out what you're supposed to be showing us.

They look like a PCB from a burglar alarm

not going to try the 16mm again as it has to be forced into the connectors and they are rated to a max of 10mm on the book

They are so having a laugh.

Not really - the cable needs to be 63A as installed yes, however there is no reason you cannot change size depending on the environment where the cable is installed for example from CU to local 63A switch in say a 35mm and from the 63A switch to point of utilisation in say a 10mm high temp rubber.

not getting anymore electricians

Please reconsider this, your own safety.

Had to do an electrical installation module to gain my NVQ2 also have an A level in electronics and Physics

I had to do a bit of mechanical fitting work for my NVQ2. I am not a mechanical fitter by any stretch of the imagination though.

 

[RF Lighting]

DON'T tin the wires FFS

You've already had a failed mains connection. Tinning the ends will nicely provide you with another failed set of connections.

I really think you need to be employing the services of a commercial electrician.

Your joke of an electrician didn't have the first clue what he was doing, and I'm afraid it sounds like you don't either.

 

[mrrigidtool]

get the piont about not being a sparky however if its done in accordance of the manufacturer's instruction then if there is a fualt i.e under rated cable ect then it's down to them will pull one of the guys of site to inspect it arfter

Untitled

• mrrigidtool
• 21 Nov 2008
• 1

Untitled

• mrrigidtool
• 21 Nov 2008
• 1