brake discs"lipped"

[Jim]

When asking about replacing my brake pads I was told that as my discs were "lipped" I should replace them as well. Does this sound right or is it a way of the company earning more profit. It is the first set of pads since the car was new in 2000(Volvo V70). Any views please ?
Jim

 

[securespark]

How many miles?

 

[chainsaw_masochist]

I am no expert in this field but what I have been told is that brake discs are now made asbestos free - good for our breathing but less durable than before. Therefore discs are sometimes prone to damage - warping, lipping, whatever.

You never said what you have been charged (if you have got that far yet) but looking in the Euro Car Parts catalogue the following is quoted:

S70/V70/C70 96-00 Front 280mm 320mm Front Pads
ATE 21.00 27.50 ATE 22.50
Guttman 19.99 n/a Textar 29.85

Rear 280mm 320mm Rear Pads
ATE 23.50 18.99 ATE 26.95
Guttman 28.25 n/a Textar 33.11

Remember that these are not proprietary manufacturers parts so will be substantially cheaper.

 

[chainsaw_masochist]

Sorry have to stick in these underscores to make the figures line up:

S70/V70/C70 96-00 Front___280mm_320mm_______Front Pads
________________ATE_____21.00___27.50_______ATE 22.50
________________Guttman__19.99___n/a________Textar 29.85

________________Rear 280mm 320mm___________Rear Pads
________________ ATE_____23.50___18.99_______ATE 26.95
_________________Guttman 28.25____n/a________Textar 33.11

 

[TexMex]

When break discs are new, they are flat. Since the break pads do not sit on the very edge, when the pads wear the disc down, this does not wear down, and hence the lip.

The lip itself can lead to Squeeling and accelerated wear of pads. If it is not too serious you can remove the lip by judicious use of a grind stone in a drill. Just remove the wheel, and while turning the disk slowly with one hand, apply the grindstone to lip, untill it is flush with the rest of the disc.

If you don't fancy doing it yourself, you can take them to any automotive engineering shop and they'll resurface them for you, (dirt cheap). It's just a two minute job in a lathe.

Obviously, if the discs have had too much material worn away, they will need replacing. But it's unlikely that you could have acheived that much wear with just one set of pads.

 

[pipme]

Take care here.
There is a minimum thickness for the disc, Tex is right discs can be turned flat and lip free at the expense of thickness (there is usually an allowance for remachining).
If all else is in good order, I have and would, file the lip off, I find it easier to run the file flat to disc surface, only I may add, with the disc removed.
My own experience, with my Nissan 60K miles 2sets front pads, was that the main dealer supplied new discs at the same price as a 'Wholesaler' ... Who, with a non-Nissan catalogue reference was about to sell me discs which were not correct !!!
I had presented myself armed with a removed disc, my micrometer, vernier calipers and plenty of time ... Believe me the discs offered were :- a) too thin b) Slightly differently offset, disc to location face c) Smaller Overall Diameter (O/D).
Subsequently discs from main dealer matched perfectly the discs removed, and have proven excellent. cost to buy £98 the pair .. peace of mind £priceless !!
I am told roughly 2 sets of pads nowadays to a disc change .... Due to the removal of asbestos from the available pad lining materials ... Pads and disc wear have not been properly matched yet ... allegedly.
Thinner discs may give rise to warping under hard braking ... juddering steering ... but appear ok with gentler use.

P

 

[Jim]

Thank you for all the info. The mileage is 57k. I havent noticed any braking problem but when I got the front pads done they tried to sell the idea of discs but I wasnt convinced. The rear pads were only about 50% worn about 3 months ago( according to another mechanic). The info will help me to question better as I am about to go back for a check on the rear pads again.
Jim

 

[david and julie]

With brakes its not so much the ammount of mileage, it is the ammount of use. At 57K there will be some wear on the discs. Just because your brakes seem OK doesn't mean there not worn. The wear on your old pads matches the disc wear,whereas that won't be the case with new ones.

The back brakes do very little work compared to the fronts and you can't compare the two.

If you don't trust the garage take a front wheel off and have a look yourself.

 

[pipme]

Yep, heavy brake use and / or stopping from higher speeds leads to greater wear, before making extensive use of motorways I was never 'hard' on brakes .... that changed, I think ABS plays a part too, without that, scare free, wet driving meant thoughtful braking .. not so much care required with ABS.
P

 

[noflame]

Just fit some new discs and pads- a lot cheaper than skimming, etc-get them from euro car parts or german,swedish&french. You can fit them your self in an afternoon.
Brake pads no longer contain asbestos, and as a result are a lot harder on the discs than they used to be-57000 is not a bad time to change them!

 

[2scoops0406]

57K not too bad at all. Had my cars discs replaced at 22K, I probably wouldn't bother with having them ground (but check) disc are often not that expensive these days, and in general you're paying for the labour anyway.

 

[pipme]

I certainly would not replace discs just for lipping .. file off the lip !!

Yep, I replaced d and p's ... But I will never entertain 'after market' braking stuff, anyway my Nissan discs were same price at dealers.

Better to be turned not ground (IMHO) Turning gives that rougher surface more grip for the rub .... eases the bedding process !!


Ed' say £40 for pads £100 pair of discs £6.36 approx per 1k Miles front only ??? Scandulous .. what you a racing driver ? or drive on the brakes ?

P

 

[2scoops0406]

I certainly would not replace discs just for lipping .. file off the lip !!

Yep, I replaced d and p's ... But I will never entertain 'after market' braking stuff, anyway my Nissan discs were same price at dealers.

Better to be turned not ground (IMHO) Turning gives that rougher surface more grip for the rub .... eases the bedding process !!


Ed' say £40 for pads £100 pair of discs £6.36 approx per 1k Miles front only ??? Scandulous .. what you a racing driver ? or drive on the brakes ?

P

Difficult to say, depends whether you are willing to pay £17.99 for a cable. seriously, how much does it cost (if you can't do it yourself) to have discs re-ground, personally never tried myself, as said its usually only the fronts that get lipped? Re the driving on the brake, I wouldn't wish to comment on my wifes driving!

 

[2scoops0406]

I certainly would not replace discs just for lipping .. file off the lip !!

Yep, I replaced d and p's ... But I will never entertain 'after market' braking stuff, anyway my Nissan discs were same price at dealers.

Better to be turned not ground (IMHO) Turning gives that rougher surface more grip for the rub .... eases the bedding process !!


Ed' say £40 for pads £100 pair of discs £6.36 approx per 1k Miles front only ??? Scandulous .. what you a racing driver ? or drive on the brakes ?

P

Worse than that, 8 pads, not 4 on the front, and it gets through pads like fury about 12k for a new set of fronts, 24k all 16!, the discs don't really need changing that often, I just like being safe / ripped off !!

I truly hate that car!!

 

[pipme]

......I truly hate that car!!

So do I mate !! More expensive than a wife !! about £22 per 1000 miles on brakes alone .... !!