ceiling bother?

[sheldon1982]

i could do with some advise, i am really struggling with ceilings i cant seem to get them polished of blemish free.
i have done 4 ceilings now and have only got 1 really good but that was a bathroom and was only small.

i have got some stilts coming tomorrow, hoping they will help with my speed maybe that will help?

any advise guys

 

[Richard C]

I’ve thought about but never tried stilts, I think they only really become viable if you intend getting into it big time & they will also make you more or less dependant on a mate on large ceilings. I use a couple of robust sets of kitchen steps & a few varying lengths of scaffold board but adjustable trestles will work just as well; in small rooms I will just use either one or both sets of steps. Some use upturned crates & boards but after a nasty ankle injury when a plank supported over Theramalite blocks twisted & fell over I would not advise stacking anything. The height of the hop up is important; royc gave advice some time ago about setting the most comfortable working height, this being achieved by putting your outstretched hand in between the ceiling and touching your head with your thumb.

The principles for a good finish on ceilings are really no different to walls; just that ceilings are over your head, 3X more difficult, much harder work & initially more plaster will end up on you than the ceiling; I still groan when ceilings in larger rooms are involved. If you haven’t yet mastered ceiling basics, stilts won’t really help &, if anything, will exasperate the problems you’re already having until you get used to using them, especially on smaller rooms. If were just talking straight skimming, perseverance & practice should take care of it automatically the faster & more experienced you get, then move to stilts if both the amount of work & the size of room warrants it.

 

[sheldon1982]

thanks for the quick reply. i think my speed is the problem with ceilings and the main problem is getting up and down of the board to move it back so i can plaster across again, i thought if i could get the hang of the stilts it would save me so much time and help me in the long run.

great advise thanks, any advise as to when the weather is really hot when your skimming because i was doing a ceiling last weekend and the muck was going off at an alarming rate making me rush. is there anything you can do that will slow down the rate it goes off on a hot day

 

[Richard C]

I don’t know how you’re working your hop up but always plaster across the (narrowest) width; I can traverse a 6 x 4m ceiling with only 4 hop up moves (5 at most). I know it’s difficult when you first start on ceilings as you tend to drop so much of it (much of it on yourself so watch your eyes) but don’t worry about what it looks like just get the 1st coat up there as even & as quick as you possibly can; a consistent hawk to trowel action, how much you pick up & spread has a huge bearing on how quickly & effectively you can do this (much like brick laying) but it eventually becomes second nature. A quick second pass across the whole celing to even it all out should see you ready for the second coat (but I don't always do that on small areas ) which will slow things down enough to give you time to work on the finish. You’ve really only got around 40-45 minutes to get the 1st lot up there & it can seem like an impossible task but as you move forward, you’ll relax more & start to enjoy it; personally not sure that will ever be possible for me with ceilings as they still stress me out . But staying clam & feeling in control of what’s happening is so very important but, if you’ve a knack for it, you’ll hopefully get there.

Ambient temperature/humidity will always have an effect on how quick it goes off; I’ve had no particular problems yet this year; apart from a few days a couple of weeks ago now, it’s not been particularly hot here (I think it’s been a bit warmer in the Midlands though). Forgive me if my memory is lacking & it’s been covered with you before but; old/badly stored gear, over mixing, dirty tubs/ tools, too stiff an initial mix will send it off more quickly than you need as will lack of/incorrect prep on the ceiling (or wall) base your skimming. Control suction, which affects your availble time, is going to be your biggest enemy when your inexperienced & struggling to get your speed up but, at the moment, I really don’t think stilts will help you.

 

[Micilin]

thanks for the quick reply. i think my speed is the problem with ceilings and the main problem is getting up and down of the board to move it back so i can plaster across again, i thought if i could get the hang of the stilts it would save me so much time and help me in the long run.

great advise thanks, any advise as to when the weather is really hot when your skimming because i was doing a ceiling last weekend and the muck was going off at an alarming rate making me rush. is there anything you can do that will slow down the rate it goes off on a hot day

Good advice from Richard there (although I disagree entirely about stilts making you dependent on a mate!!) A nice bench will do you , if you can use one that will let you reach each side of the room without moving it, that will be ideal.

For the stuff going off, make sure no draughts - no matter how much you'd like a cooling breeze! A good handful of board adhesive will slow the stuff down a bit for you but the real key is to be organised , and not to panic.

If you do a lot of ceilings it is worth getting stilts (and if you do a lot of them, for 90 quid it's something to consider).
Even if you put on the ceiling with a bench first and then just trowel up off stilts while you get used to them, you will save time in the long run. But they are not magic, they won't improve your plastering as soon as you strap them on, as Richard says.

More important is to get a good technique, nice flowing action laying on and trowelling ; be able to take the stuff off the top of the hawk, not the bottom EVEN IF THIS IS HARDER IN THE SHORT TERM; take it off the spotboard cleanly etc

 

[sheldon1982]

thanks for the sound advise guys, i have got the stilts coming tomorrow and have a hallway and landing plus a bedroom to do next month so i will practise with them then (plus walking around the house to get used to them). i work out of a bucket should i get a spot board woud that help me.
what is an average ceiling to plaster , the biggest i have done so far was 18ft by 12ft and i got that on ok but struggled to polish it because of the heat it was about 30 degrees in the room with no breeze at all and the plaster was going off very fast. practise makes perfect i guess and after all i am still learning but loving every minute of it. cheers

 

[roughcaster]

thanks for the sound advise guys, i have got the stilts coming tomorrow and have a hallway and landing plus a bedroom to do next month so i will practise with them then (plus walking around the house to get used to them). i work out of a bucket should i get a spot board woud that help me.
what is an average ceiling to plaster , the biggest i have done so far was 18ft by 12ft and i got that on ok but struggled to polish it because of the heat it was about 30 degrees in the room with no breeze at all and the

practise makes perfect i guess and after all i am still learning but loving every minute of it. cheers

That's the main thing Sheldon!!

 

[Micilin]

thanks for the sound advise guys, i have got the stilts coming tomorrow and have a hallway and landing plus a bedroom to do next month so i will practise with them then (plus walking around the house to get used to them). i work out of a bucket should i get a spot board woud that help me.
what is an average ceiling to plaster , the biggest i have done so far was 18ft by 12ft and i got that on ok but struggled to polish it because of the heat it was about 30 degrees in the room with no breeze at all and the plaster was going off very fast. practise makes perfect i guess and after all i am still learning but loving every minute of it. cheers

A board and stand will gain you a lot of time, especially on the stilts.
I don't really think there is much point worrying about what an 'average' plasterer will do - geting it right is more a priority. You managed a 20m2 ceiling in the heat, so you're not too bad!

Domestic vs site work are different , and conditions will vary too.

On site, 3 x 30m2 guages for a man on his own would be a benchmark for a day's work, I suppose. In a house with dustsheets, nowhere to wash out etc etc, you might do well to get 2 x 15 m2 done!

On the stilts - clean floor, NEVER walk backwards, lift the feet up a bit more than usual , put the leg strap on first, take it off last, check everything tight before each guage, have water buckets handy at good height.

A routine might be - mix, get up and put it on, flatten it, get down, mix and wash out, get up, lay it down, trowel up, get down.

 

[Richard C]

Got to admit I’ve never tried stilts so just my perception; you obviously aren’t going to be able to do like Mr “Jack in the box” on a trestle hop up but having no experience on stilts, I hadn’t even considered the “change in tactics” necessary to keep you going while your up there; could be an interesting experiment for me

Christ Sheldon, you said small ceilings; if you’re doing 24 sq/m of ceiling in one hit on your own & getting minimal probs, your doing pretty damn well.

 

[1john]

DIY doing 24 sq m, wow , i find a 16 sq m ceiling a bloody good work out, although easier with a mate to load you up. Good effort

 

[Micilin]

Is my maths out?

 

[Richard C]

Is my maths out?

No your spot on the mark; couldn’t be bothered to convert it & was feeling generous.

 

[sheldon1982]

thanks for the great advise guys

will keep at it