Earthing Question & Downlight Wiring

[slackworth]

Hi All,

I am currently in the process of decorating at the moment and got a couple of queries - easy one first - I've got a ceiling pendant at the moment and want to convert to 4x LED downlights. Should they be wired as per picture 1 or picture 2? You'll have to excuse the MS Paint skills! The middle circle being the current pedant light and the 4 outer circles being the proposed downlights.

Secondly and this is the one I don't understand. We have an extension built in 2013 and at the time had a new consumer unit fitted due to having an old fusebox and at the same time they moved the meter and fitted a PME system. Currently there is an earth wire going to the consumer unit from the PME system and then another earth wire which goes towards the pipes with the "Safety Electrical Connection" clips pictured but doesn't actually connect to anything - it's just a loose bit of wire that's shoved down the middle:

There is also a junction box in another corner of the room and similar scenario - there's an earth wire coming out of it that just goes through the joists and ends unconnected as you can just about see:



Is it right that these earth wires are just floating about or should they some how be connected somewhere and if so where? I would guess the connections on the pipework but would rather know from someone a little more in the know.

The work was done by a qualified spark and was all certified etc so just not sure why it's like it is.

 

[flameport]

The downlights can be wired either way, it makes no difference.
The junction box or whatever at the old pendant location must either remain accessible, or be a type which is maintenance free (items with screw terminals are not).

The bonding wires should be connected to the metallic pipes. Unclear why they have not been.

 

[mwatsonxx]

The downlights can be wired either way, it makes no difference.

Have you ever tried connecting 5 t&e's into a ceiling rose?

To the op, your drawing 2 is the way to do it.

 

[flameport]

Have you ever tried connecting 5 t&e's into a ceiling rose?

Obviously not.
In both of the examples given, the ceiling rose will need to be removed and some other type of junction box installed.

 

[slackworth]

The ceiling rose will become a junction box so thanks for the help on that one. The advice on the maintenance free box I didn't know about so will take that into account.

As for the earth I am confused too! I will connect them up to the pipes!

 

[Taylortwocities]

The ceiling rose will become a junction box

So the ceiling rose will remain where it is, screwed onto the ceiling?

Sorry, need clarifiaction as to what you plan to do there.

 

[slackworth]

Sorry...the ceiling rose will be redundant, removed, hole plastered over and will just essentially become a junction box between the joists to start the wiring for the downlighters from.

 

[Taylortwocities]

You cannot use the old rose as a hidden junction box.
You must use a maintenance free junction box, like this
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html

 

[slackworth]

Got it! Found one similar on Screwfix which is listed as maintenance free so will fit that tomorrow.

I've bonded the earth wires to the pipe clamps now. Thanks for the help all.

 

[EFLImpudence]

They're bonding conductors (wires).

Necessary because the pipes are earthed - by the ground.

 

[slackworth]

All safe and sound now....still confused as to the reason they were just floating in the ceiling so think this one has to officially go down as "one of those things".

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Well let's hope that the so-called electrician who didn't bond the pipes correctly but lied on a certificate to say that he had has not left you any more of those things.