Fence Height on sloping Ground

[Geronimoe]

Hiya All.
Have a problem with my rear garden fence which hoping someone cleverer than me can answer.
I live on a hillside in a 1960,s Bungalow and all the houses have a retaining wall running down a rectangular garden.
If i measure from bottom and the top of the garden to original ground level my fence is 1.5 metres high but in the middle the ground is lower so fence is higher. (1.650 metres)

I had a complaint from neighbour about my lights in garden so i installed fence higher in the middle of my garden 500mm higher to stop the light emitting into her side,
which has made the fence higher than 2 metres ( 2.150 metres ) in that position but is still only 2 metres if measured from the top or bottom of the garden.

Now had further complaint to council that fence is to high and Planning Enforcement Officer has been out and when he measured the fence he measured down the side of my retaining wall to neighbours ground height and told me my fence was 2.5 metres high.

This sounded ridiculous to me and he quoted me Regs.

The relevant interpretation of ground level in the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 is defined as follows:
2) Unless the context otherwise requires, any reference in this Order to the height of a building or of plant or machinery is to be construed as a reference to its height when measured from ground level; and for the purposes of this paragraph “ground level” means the level of the surface of the ground immediately adjacent to the building or plant or machinery in question or, where the level of the surface of the ground on which it is situated or is to be situated is not uniform, the level of the highest part of the surface of the ground adjacent to it

Now reading this in my mind do i need to raise the whole fence to 2 metres to comply with Permitted Development as the regs state ( the level of the highest part of the surface of the ground adjacent to it ) and can i keep the fence level or do i have to follow the ground height ?

Philip

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I had a complaint from neighbour about my lights in garden so i installed fence higher in the middle of my garden 500mm higher to stop the light emitting into her side,

You could lower the fence to 2m, and adjust/ mask the lights, so they don't show over the fence.

 

[Geronimoe]

Yes that is

You could lower the fence to 2m, and adjust/ mask the lights, so they don't show over the fence.

Yes that is an option i will take but would prefer to raise fence height if possible.
And this is the problem Planning officer has told me to drop my new section of fence to original height of 1.650 metres as he measured down side of retaining wall to neighbours ground height
If you met my newish lovely neighbours you would want a fence as high as possible. LOL

 

[stevie888]

In these planning situations the height is the highest part of the ground adjacent the structure so a building on a slope can be quite high and still comply. I'd suggest a fence would normally expect to follow the shape of the land so not quite the same, but measured on the high side.

I wonder who rattled the council cage? I struggle to believe they have just happened upon this. Our neighbour to rear put up a fence (a total abortion, but that's another story!) which was too high but the council refused to act when we complained.

 

[Geronimoe]

In these planning situations the height is the highest part of the ground adjacent the structure so a building on a slope can be quite high and still comply. I'd suggest a fence would normally expect to follow the shape of the land so not quite the same, but measured on the high side.

I wonder who rattled the council cage? I struggle to believe they have just happened upon this. Our neighbour to rear put up a fence (a total abortion, but that's another story!) which was too high but the council refused to act when we complained.

I have had on objection to my fence lodged with the council.
The planning officer didn't name who had objected to the fence but as it only affects one side (Hmmm)

 

[big-all]

the "structure" in this case is the single individual fence panel and nothing farther away
adjacent means touching or within inches as far as fences are concerened

 

[RrogerD]

How about as Harry above says, you lower the fence, adjust your lights and go around to them with a bottle of plonk and an apology, "can we start over?".
It must be awfully draining not getting on with neighbours. A lot is down to miscommunication. Just keep talking.
Remember, it takes two to tango.

 

[Geronimoe]

the "structure" in this case is the single individual fence panel and nothing farther away
adjacent means touching or within inches as far as fences are concerened

No fence panels just one structure all shiplap cladding

 

[Geronimoe]

How about as Harry above says, you lower the fence, adjust your lights and go around to them with a bottle of plonk and an apology, "can we start over?".
It must be awfully draining not getting on with neighbours. A lot is down to miscommunication. Just keep talking.
Remember, it takes two to tango.

Lovely sentiment and i wish it was possible but raising of the fence has its reasons and privacy without being recorded in my own garden is one among numerous other issues i wouldn't be able to discuss in an open forum.
Thought this forum was about planning and Building Regulations and not neighbourly relations counselling

 

[big-all]

No fence panels just one structure all shiplap cladding

you are misunderstanding how things work a fence panel runs between 2 adjacent posts the higher off the two posts is the datum point for that panel with the next panel needs to be stepped down or at an angle as the datum point is now the other post that is now at a lower level

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[Geronimoe]

you are misunderstanding how things work a fence panel runs between 2 adjacent posts the higher off the two posts is the datum point for that panel with the next panel needs to be stepped down or at an angle as the datum point is now the other post that is now at a lower level

Explore House

Explore the Planning Portal Interactive House and Mini Guides to learn about the planning rules and building regulations that could affect your project

interactive.planningportal.co.uk

Yes makes sense but still struggling to find this interpretation in the planning rules and would love to be guided to where it covers this.

As the planning officer was using and quoted me the Regs which covers (building or plant or machinery) which then goes on to
state (the level of the highest part of the surface of the ground adjacent to it)

Why has he measured from the bottom of my retaining wall and not my ground level which only allows me to have a fence 1.650 metres high ?

 

[jono_h]

Why has he measured from the bottom of my retaining wall and not my ground level which only allows me to have a fence 1.650 metres high ?

Because the bottom of the retaining wall is the ‘natural’ ground level?

If your retaining wall was built and backfilled it could be argued it gives you an artificial ground level. Anyone looking to circumvent the height restrictions when building could just pile a load of spoil up and go “I’m allowed x metres from the top of that”

If you think that the top of the retaining wall is the actual ground level then argue that point with Planning.

 

[stevie888]

On a sloping site it's more likely they would have done a cut-to-fill exercise to level up the gardens so you have a bit of fill neighboiur has a bit of cut. I still maintain that the higher ground is the one that determines but as Big-all points out panel by panel.

 

[jono_h]

On a sloping site it's more likely they would have done a cut-to-fill exercise to level up the gardens so you have a bit of fill neighboiur has a bit of cut. I still maintain that the higher ground is the one that determines but as Big-all points out panel by panel.

Completely agree Stevie. Just trying to come up with a reason why they might have done it that way - correctly, or incorrectly.

 

[Notch7]

If you met my newish lovely neighbours you would want a fence as high as possible. LOL

make the fence lower then put in some tall bamboo or something similar that grows to 3 metres