Fire regulations - separation of kitchen from stairs

[texasholden]

I have two rooms on the ground floor - a lounge (containing the staircase to the first floor) and a kitchen / diner.

There is a freestanding double sided log burner in the chimney breast which separates the two rooms.

I am planning on an extention to the kitchen, but my architect has warned that because my kitchen will be effectively connected to the staircase, I may need to:

a) Install a sprinkler system in the kitchen
b) remove double sided burner, block up aperture and install a fire door between the lounge and kitchen/diner.

Can anyone think of any other solutions?

 

[OwainDIYer]

Ask the architect WHY you "may" be required to do this.

Either you are or you aren't, and the reason will be found in the relevant section of the Building Regulations.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

The escape route cannot be made worse than the existing.

Where is the door to the outside at present? Off the lounge presumably? 2 floors or 3 floors?

It’s not very clear what the proposed is tbh, and how the kitchen extension is going to be connected to the staircase or how it differs from the existing, can you upload your existing & proposed plans?

OwainDIYer, Fire Regs in dwellings when changes to the plan are proposed can carry an element of negotiation with them, some BCO’s will be more/or less flexible than others so sometimes it comes down to the individual inspector as to what he will pass.

But anyway not really enough info to comment.

 

[texasholden]

Thanks for the info freddy.

FYI main entrance is via the lounge - it's a two storey, two bed old cottage. The proposed extension is to the rear, and will be adding a further bedroom to the upstairs.

To be honest I accept that the risks will be increased by having an additional bedroom so I was just wondering whether I could avoid the yearly inspections etc that go with a sprinkler system (fire doors would be circumvented by the log burner)

I'll look to upload some drawings so that you can see what I mean.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

So if the extension is to the rear then it begs the question why the existing escape is compromised (or making it worse than existing). Need to see some plans. The increased risk (if I understand your posts) is not from having an extra bedroom, it is that the only escape from the upper floor (apart from via bedroom windows) is via a staircase that is to be open to the kitchen (the highest fire risk room).

 

[texasholden]

Sorry, I didn't realise the risk assessment worked in that way.

In which case, I should have told you that at the rear of the property is a flat roof conservatory (which will be replaced by the two storey extenstion).

Currently a window upstairs opens fully to allow an escape onto the flat roof - and that will obviously be removed.

Sorry for not being clear before. Drawings to follow.

 

[jeds]

I'm struggling to see how you are making things worse. You are extending the kitchen but just making a kitchen bigger doesn't alter the risk. What makes your fire escape situation worse than existing?

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

Yes more info required please.

 

[texasholden]

Hi guys,

Hopefully these will help explain the situation.

From the previous comments received I'd imagine the main issue could be the removal of the escape route from one upstairs bedroom, onto the conservatory flat roof.

Untitled

• texasholden
• 21 Jun 2013
• 1

Untitled

• texasholden
• 21 Jun 2013
• 1

 

[jeds]

Doesn't look like the risk is any different to me. If you have compliant fire escape windows to the upper floor bedrooms you could even argue the risk is reduced by the fact the new kitchen is now further from the bottom of the stairs.

 

[OwainDIYer]

Over the flat roof isn't an acceptable means of escape anyway - but it could be if it's constructed as such with proper rails and escape staircase.

If I've read the stair orientation right, and if you have access through the back garden through a back alley, then you could put a door at the foot of the stairs and make the window an external door, so you can do direct from the foot of the stairs to outside.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

The existing layout affords a protected escape route (of sorts as it is via the living room) from the first floor to the front door.

The proposed layout with the wood burner and the hole in the wall is worse because that escape route is compromised, any fire in the kitchen will enable smoke to find its way through that hole in the wall and prevent escape via the living room.

Or that's the black and white answer anyway. As for solution I'd say your arch needs to get a dialogue going with BC and see where he gets. See what the BCO will be prepared to accept. Maybe that will be sprinklers, maybe he'll let it go, maybe he'll accept wired alarms in each room or maybe just say no. Fires don't always happen to someone else.

Jeds you need to put your glasses on!

 

[jeds]

The existing layout affords a protected escape route (of sorts as it is via the living room) from the first floor to the front door.

The proposed layout with the wood burner and the hole in the wall is worse because that escape route is compromised, any fire in the kitchen will enable smoke to find its way through that hole in the wall and prevent escape via the living room.

Or that's the black and white answer anyway. As for solution I'd say your arch needs to get a dialogue going with BC and see where he gets. See what the BCO will be prepared to accept. Maybe that will be sprinklers, maybe he'll let it go, maybe he'll accept wired alarms in each room or maybe just say no. Fires don't always happen to someone else.

Jeds you need to put your glasses on!

You're right. I do. For some reason the pic is a bit fuzzy on my screen.