i have just fitted a new kitchen and removed the old free standing electric cooker. Can i attach a double plug socket to the now (vacant) wire??
fit socket to cooker circuit
- Thread starter westy123
- Start date
hi,
right, i understand you have a cooker circuit then? and now you have done away with the cooker you want to use this point as a double socket?
is this correct?
you can check if you have a cooker circuit by looking at the CU/fuseboard, itl more than likely be a 32A mcb of 30A fusewire.
cant see a problem with turning it into a socket outlet as long as all done correctly, are you aware of part p by the way?
biggest problem could be terminating 6mm cores into the terminals although they should go ( dont recall ever doing this!)
rcd protection will be required too if the circuit could be used to supply outdoor equipment, which it more than likely will be.
give us some cable size info and protective device info and we may be able to offer some more suggestions on how to get the best out of the setup you have.
right, i understand you have a cooker circuit then? and now you have done away with the cooker you want to use this point as a double socket?
is this correct?
you can check if you have a cooker circuit by looking at the CU/fuseboard, itl more than likely be a 32A mcb of 30A fusewire.
cant see a problem with turning it into a socket outlet as long as all done correctly, are you aware of part p by the way?
biggest problem could be terminating 6mm cores into the terminals although they should go ( dont recall ever doing this!)
rcd protection will be required too if the circuit could be used to supply outdoor equipment, which it more than likely will be.
give us some cable size info and protective device info and we may be able to offer some more suggestions on how to get the best out of the setup you have.
yep, exactly that, i'd like to use this point as a double socket.
the socket won't be used for outdoor equipment, just to plug in microwave, kettle etc.
It is a dedicated 30A cooker circuit, and though i'll have to check the size of the cable (not at home at the mo) i think it's as you describe.
protective device info??? not sure what you mean.
Thanks
the socket won't be used for outdoor equipment, just to plug in microwave, kettle etc.
It is a dedicated 30A cooker circuit, and though i'll have to check the size of the cable (not at home at the mo) i think it's as you describe.
protective device info??? not sure what you mean.
Thanks
Protective device = circuit breaker, fuse?
a dedicated 30A cooker circuit will almost certainly have 6mm cores, thinking about it these should fit into the terminals on a standard double socket.
as i said its ok to do this, you can actually buy cooker switches that have a socket outlet on them- this could be an option for you to consider if in the future you think a cooker may go there.
understand what your saying about not be used for outdoor equipment but who's to say that your missus might not plug the lawnmower or hedgetrimmers in there one day, its actually a regulation but the grey area is deciding if its to be used outside........ put it this way, i bet 99% of sparks would rcd it.
having said that its your home so its down to you really. as this work is in the kitchen also i believe part p plays a part here.
hope ive given you enough to go on.
regards.
a dedicated 30A cooker circuit will almost certainly have 6mm cores, thinking about it these should fit into the terminals on a standard double socket.
as i said its ok to do this, you can actually buy cooker switches that have a socket outlet on them- this could be an option for you to consider if in the future you think a cooker may go there.
understand what your saying about not be used for outdoor equipment but who's to say that your missus might not plug the lawnmower or hedgetrimmers in there one day, its actually a regulation but the grey area is deciding if its to be used outside........ put it this way, i bet 99% of sparks would rcd it.
having said that its your home so its down to you really. as this work is in the kitchen also i believe part p plays a part here.
hope ive given you enough to go on.
regards.
I do not want to start an argument industry spark but I think suggesting the use of an rcd is a bit of overkill, as you said yourself the cooker swich could have had a socket built in anyway & an extension lead can be plugged into any socket in any location,new regs are not retrospective. Iwould say part p will not apply in this case as it would be no different than simply replacing the cooker switch with a new one including a socket so part p not relevant. I cannot see any problem with what is being proposed as long as the fuse/mcb is the correct rating & any labelling in the consumer unit is changed from" cooker switch" to "kitchen socket". Westy , you say "an old cooker switch" you must ensure that the cable is ok, ie do an insulation test if there is any doubt about the suitability of it.Does the insulation look ok at the ends? Is it cracked or perished?
JJ4091,
overkill maybe but its the regs that say ''any socket that may be used to supply portable equipment outside must be rcd protected''....or words to that effect.
whats to say the socket location isnt at the side of the window overlooking te back garden where hedges are trimmed, lawns cut, etc.
extension lead is irrelevant as we are talking fixed wiring, we cant compensate for what peopl do.
i pointed out cooker outlets having a socket outlet yes, i know a few sparks however who now put the cooker circuit on the rcd side of s/l boards to give protection of the socket outlet. me personally id fit one without a socket outlet.
i mentioned part p as kitchen is special location so i thought relevant.... clarify anyone?
agree about the checks on circuit required but is mr westy really going to have the equipment/ knowledge to do an IR test. this is the reason i adviced to consider part p and getting a spark in.
overkill maybe but its the regs that say ''any socket that may be used to supply portable equipment outside must be rcd protected''....or words to that effect.
whats to say the socket location isnt at the side of the window overlooking te back garden where hedges are trimmed, lawns cut, etc.
extension lead is irrelevant as we are talking fixed wiring, we cant compensate for what peopl do.
i pointed out cooker outlets having a socket outlet yes, i know a few sparks however who now put the cooker circuit on the rcd side of s/l boards to give protection of the socket outlet. me personally id fit one without a socket outlet.
i mentioned part p as kitchen is special location so i thought relevant.... clarify anyone?
agree about the checks on circuit required but is mr westy really going to have the equipment/ knowledge to do an IR test. this is the reason i adviced to consider part p and getting a spark in.
As I said industryspark I do not want to argue & what you are saying, apart from part p, is correct,but if mr westy can't ensure the job is done safely he should not do it at all & he definately won't have the knowledge to fit an rcd, & I say again the regs are not retrospective & do not apply to circuitry that was installed before the reg was introduced.
IndustrySpark you are correct in recomending that an RCd be fitted if a socket is substituted for the cooker switch in the kitchen.
Thanks for all the advice....erm...did not mean to start an argument
on balance i think with my limited experience the safest and easiest option would be to install a new cooker switch, and use the socket on that. TBH i would not do this myself were it not for the prohibitive cost (quoted £200+ just for this socket! because of part p i suspect) i would have someone with a bit more knowledge to do it!
Anyway, thanks again
on balance i think with my limited experience the safest and easiest option would be to install a new cooker switch, and use the socket on that. TBH i would not do this myself were it not for the prohibitive cost (quoted £200+ just for this socket! because of part p i suspect) i would have someone with a bit more knowledge to do it!
Anyway, thanks again
westy123 said:Thanks for all the advice....erm...did not mean to start an argument
on balance i think with my limited experience the safest and easiest option would be to install a new cooker switch, and use the socket on that. TBH i would not do this myself were it not for the prohibitive cost (quoted £200+ just for this socket! because of part p i suspect) i would have someone with a bit more knowledge to do it!
Anyway, thanks again
Not an argument, but a different personal interpertation of the regs!!!
You have made a good decision, but if you fit a cooker switch with a socket, you still need to shift the cooker cable in the CU to the RCD side.
In any case I would put an RCD on any sockets installed on the ground floor in any room, as is required by NECEIC.
hey, no offence meant and non taken jj,
nothing like a good debate, we all have our own way of doing things afterall.
perhaps the easiest thing he could do is fit an rcd socket outlet? little more expensive maybe but its an option. obviously if changing the mcb onto rcd side of s/l board he would need a spark in.
nothing like a good debate, we all have our own way of doing things afterall.
perhaps the easiest thing he could do is fit an rcd socket outlet? little more expensive maybe but its an option. obviously if changing the mcb onto rcd side of s/l board he would need a spark in.
Certainly no offence intended industryspark I have just re-read the threads & was presumiing he did not have a split load or rcd protected consumer unit which in old instalations is quite common around here. Perhaps I was focusing too much on the word "old".Still don't think part p applies though, but we will have to agree to disagree on that one
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