Fortic cylinder replacement - reputable brand?

[dishman]

Looking at replacing a fortic cylinder in the near future. It's way past it's prime and hot water pressure is woeful.

I will be looking to replace it with direct (dual immersion) unvented cylinder to run on an E7 system.

I've considered other options but I think that is the best one. It's a two bedroom flat on one level with one small bathroom.

So, I would be looking for something in the 150 litres range with very good insulation and reputation.

Any experienced recommendations in terms of brand? Are they all much of a muchnesss?

 

[gas112]

So have you had your incoming mains tested ?

 

[oldbuffer]

1. You need an incoming mains flow rate of around 20 litres per minute at a dynamic (at least one mains outlet running while you measuer the pressure) pressure of 2.0 bar to get good performance from an unvented cylinder.
2. Installing an unvented cylinder is a job for someone with a current G3 certification. It is not legal for anyone else to do it unless they can prove competency. Installation has to be notified to your local building control, which is normally done by the installer. If done by someone else there is normally a building control fee of several hundred pounds.
3. Part of the installation is running an expansion pipe, normally to outside. Must be in copper or one of an approved, high temperature rated plastic. Not always easy to achieve. There are various rules associated with this pipe.
4. With respect to brand, one's generally thought well of are OSO, Joule and HeatRae Sadia (Megaflo), but there are others.

 

[dishman]

Yeh, this was not something I was planning to do myself, just to make that clear.

I was mainly sounding out trusted brands or specific features that might be desirable in a modern tank.

All those things will be checked by the installer I am sure. At the very least I know what they should be checking now too!

Is there a range of flow rates that make a tank acceptable? Or a lower limit that makes it unacceptable?

Is it the kind of thing that an installer might skip on testing just to take the money and install (similar to combi boilers being inappropriately installed). If so, I will certainly look to get that data.

 

[Madrab]

With unvented, what goes in is what comes out.

Depending on what the situation is within the home will drive requirements - how many bathrooms, showers, how many in the house, how busy it is, washing machine, dishwasher etc That coupled with what is available to the property in the way of dynamic pressure and flow.

Lower limit really, is as suggested - ~20L/Min @ 2 bar dynamic - you may get away with 15L/Min if there are only one or 2 people in the house running 1 bathroom but the pressure shouldn't really be lower than that.

When getting the resource in make sure the tests are performed at a full flow tap and try to run 2 outlets at the same time.

 

[muggles]

I'd say that anything is going to be better than what you have now, so the performance query is largely a non-issue. I like UK Cylinders, Joule, and OSO brands personally.

 

[dilalio]

When you do the pressure/flow tests, make sure it is done during peak hours.

 

[dishman]

What is the difference between something like this:

UK Cylinders Elite Cyl direct unvented cylinder 150ltr | Wolseley

Looking for a UK Cylinders Cylinder ESDIR0150? Order from Wolseley today - free delivery or click and collect available nationwide.

www.wolseley.co.uk

and this

https://www.plumbnation.co.uk/heatrae-sadia-megaflo-eco-145dd-direct-unvented-hot-water-cylinder-303-5008

I skimmed the specification but most of it seems like marketing. Are there any features I am missing that warrant the price difference?

 

[muggles]

The UK Cylinders one probably takes about an hour longer to install as it doesn't have the stupid Megaflo floating baffle system that's way more hassle than it's worth. I'd go for the UK-C one

 

[dilalio]

What is the difference between something like this:

UK Cylinders Elite Cyl direct unvented cylinder 150ltr | Wolseley

Looking for a UK Cylinders Cylinder ESDIR0150? Order from Wolseley today - free delivery or click and collect available nationwide.

www.wolseley.co.uk

and this

https://www.plumbnation.co.uk/heatrae-sadia-megaflo-eco-145dd-direct-unvented-hot-water-cylinder-303-5008

I skimmed the specification but most of it seems like marketing. Are there any features I am missing that warrant the price difference?

Probably because most people say they want a Megaflo, not knowing that's a brand name.

 

[HERTS P&D]

'I want a new Hoover' do you mean vacuum cleaner?

Andy

 

[dilalio]

'I want a new Hoover' do you mean vacuum cleaner?

Andy

Or Edgar?

 

[dishman]

The UK Cylinders one probably takes about an hour longer to install as it doesn't have the stupid Megaflo floating baffle system that's way more hassle than it's worth. I'd go for the UK-C one

Do you mean it is an hour faster at installing vs the Mega?

Are there any features that are generally desirable? My logical brain says that with direct unvented it's purely insulation and quality of materials, kwh rating of the immersions and everything else is marketing bells and whistles.

I'm assuming that the UK cylinder one requires an external expansion tank?

Is it the case that while internal expansion tanks might look neater, having an external one is better for maintenance/repair. Function over form type thing.

 

[muggles]

Your logical brain is correct, and yes the UKC one requires an external expansion vessel, hence it takes about an hour longer to install. I generally prefer external vessels, the internal floating baffle system just doesn't seem to stand the test of time

 

[Johntheo5]

OSO make a cylinder with a air bubble (no external expansion vessel) but does not have a floating baffle.