Gas or electric?

[wilco88]

Hi All,

I am renovating a 1930's bungalow.
It previously had night storage heaters on an economy 7 system. These have been removed.

I was certain that having mains gas plumbed in was the only way to go - combi boiler etc.

However, a plumber i use has made me aware that electric heater technology has advanced a lot and that modern electric heaters could be the way to go instead of gas system.

The property is only 75sqm but is pretty poorly insulated (although this will be upgraded to a certain extent).

My questions:

A) Should i consider electric heating at all?
B) If i do, how do i get hot water? Electric boiler system?
C)Will it be significantly cheaper to have an electric system in terms of install cost (including an electric boiler) vs gas system?

I am aware of the current difference in cost between gas and electricity but i am also aware that electricity prices are likely to be capped and gas prices are likely to rise as part of the uk carbon reduction policy.

Installing electrical heating system could be considered future proofing?

Many thanks for all your thoughts.

 

[ETAF]

I am aware of the current difference in cost between gas and electricity but i am also aware that electricity prices are likely to be capped and gas prices are likely to rise as part of the uk carbon reduction policy.

no idea what the future may bring.
I know someone who replaced a Ec7 night storage heater system to a new ALL DAY system that was supposed to be better and cheaper, ended up with 3x the cost !!!!! , as she was home ALL day retired and elderly so had the temp set quite high on each radiator. so do be careful when reviewing the info. Maybe also visit trustpilot and look into the claims furhter.
A lot will also depend on how you use the home for heating, if out all day.
interesting article here
https://www.boilerguide.co.uk/articles/electric-boiler-vs-gas-boiler-pros-cons-running-costs

 

[Diver Fred]

My recommendation is that you need to ask this question to an EPC assessor.

the EPC certificate is what you need to sell the property but doesn't appear to be up to date or ahead of the legal requirements. That certificate will give recommendations on what to do to raise the energy efficiency.

My understanding presently with electric heating you will require more insulation to achieve the same EPC level as you can by using gas.

Personally, today, as I live in the country I'd be going for Ground Source backed up with electric. But the costs may cause you to think differently.

 

[wilco88]

Thanks.
My opinion of EPC's (the certificates not the individuals (necessarily)) is that they are 50% made up/guess work. However, it's the system we have in place and you are right, it forms an important part of the sale process.

On another note, if i plan to upgrade the insulation myself, i'm going to have to have this reflected in the EPC rating. Any tips on how to do this? Typically if you get a company to do this for you they probably provide some sort of certificate but since i'll be doing it myself i need to get my work independently verified.

Would like to do ground source but too much £££

Thanks

 

[dontbelieveawordofit]

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[Captain Nemesis]

Heat pumps are the only way that electric heating can be affordable to run compared to gas. But as you say GSHP has a large capital cost and I dont think you can get the grants for air source?

Super-insulation is all very well.... https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...n-in-effort-to-curb-covid-19-poor-ventilation

 

[Diver Fred]

On another note, if i plan to upgrade the insulation myself, i'm going to have to have this reflected in the EPC rating. Any tips on how to do this? Typically if you get a company to do this for you they probably provide some sort of certificate but since i'll be doing it myself i need to get my work independently verified.

I understand from looking into the EPC that providing you can provide evidence of installing insulation then a certificate from a company isn't necessary. That evidence (according to NRLA and the assessor I used) is Receipts for the materials and photographs of the various stages of the installation work.

Hopefully if you do go to an assessor they will do the assessment, supply you with the results but not register the assessment for the property. That is what the guy I used did and had him return when I'd completed the work.

 

[Diver Fred]

New Gas heating installations of homes will be banned from 2023 Linky

I gather from a neighbour the cost to have a new supply installed to the house is now becoming prohibitive.

 

[endecotp]

New Gas heating installations of homes will be banned from 2023

New Gas heating installations of NEW homes will be banned from 2023 2025.

 

[endecotp]

It’s not yet clear what “economic levers” will be applied in the long term.

Right now, electric heating creates less CO2 than gas because so little of the electricity comes from fossil fuel. But if the gas price were increased and many homes changed from gas to electricity, we’d have to burn coal to make that electricity. So my guess is that there will be some equalisation of prices so that these new non-gas homes aren’t unattractively-expensive to run, but they won’t go far enough to encourage existing homes to change until there is enough wind/solar/nuclear to supply that demand.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

My questions:

A) Should i consider electric heating at all?
B) If i do, how do i get hot water? Electric boiler system?
C)Will it be significantly cheaper to have an electric system in terms of install cost (including an electric boiler) vs gas system?

I am aware of the current difference in cost between gas and electricity but i am also aware that electricity prices are likely to be capped and gas prices are likely to rise as part of the uk carbon reduction policy.

Don't be fooled by the claims and hype of increased electric heater efficiency - electric heaters, by their nature, are and always have been 100% efficient. You put 1Kwh in, you get 1Kwh out, one of the laws of physics. What has improved slightly, is the methods of control - for what little difference that makes.

Gas boilers are 80 / 90% efficient, but gas costs 1/4 as much as electric, Kwh for Kwh. What the future holds for gas and gas prices is anyone's guess, but you can be sure it will not be a sudden change.

Electric heating is only really worth considering for a home which is very well insulated, so not much heat input is needed, or where it is the only option available. You mention poorly insulated.

 

[IT Minion]

Hi All,

I am renovating a 1930's bungalow.
It previously had night storage heaters on an economy 7 system. These have been removed.

I was certain that having mains gas plumbed in was the only way to go - combi boiler etc.

However, a plumber i use has made me aware that electric heater technology has advanced a lot and that modern electric heaters could be the way to go instead of gas system.

The property is only 75sqm but is pretty poorly insulated (although this will be upgraded to a certain extent).

My questions:

A) Should i consider electric heating at all?
B) If i do, how do i get hot water? Electric boiler system?
C)Will it be significantly cheaper to have an electric system in terms of install cost (including an electric boiler) vs gas system?

I am aware of the current difference in cost between gas and electricity but i am also aware that electricity prices are likely to be capped and gas prices are likely to rise as part of the uk carbon reduction policy.

Installing electrical heating system could be considered future proofing?

Many thanks for all your thoughts.

Green deal for solid wall insulation? I'm not sure on the rules wmfor what's presumably an investment but worth a check...

 

[Bodgedbuild]

You can still get grants for Air Source heating but it is not as much now as it used to be. That's the choice I made as I have no gas supply in my village. If you had a gas supply I would say it was a no brain deal to have a gas boiler installed but I can't help thinking installing a new supply might make the cost prohibitive.
I made the move to get away from oil, which I had for 20+ years as the cost to buy it varied wildly and I got fed up with remembering to order it and I can make use of the space where the tank was.
Cost wise, I am paying about the same amount to heat my house now as I was on oil but my house is now around 1/3rd larger than before.
I had considered an electric boiler backed up by solar panels but I was advised against it as the cost to heat a house on just electric would be very high indeed.

 

[wilco88]

New Gas heating installations of new homes will be banned from 2025.

 

[wilco88]

I've actually already had the quote for gas mains installation and it wasn't too bad in my opinion. £750. Or £700 if i dig the trench! Safe to say i'm not digging the trench.

I don't think there are any grants available in Scotland. Certainly, the conditions which one must meet in order to get a grant are much more strict than in England.

Thanks all. Once again this forum proves itself invaluable!