Has Part P gone too far?

[MrHumbug]

Attempting to restrict the supply of components will do two things:

1. Make the cost of 'restricted' items much greater as the supply chain becomes more complicated

2. Create a 'black market' in imported components that probably haven't been tested and certified.

Properly enforcing the existing legislation will be much more effective

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Simply answer is Part P didnt go far enough, Certain electrical items should be totally restricted from none qualified persons purchasing.

Pick any builder's merchant or shed you like.

Go down there, and you'll find you can buy all manner of items and materials (gas boilers, gas fires, WCs, windows, RSJs, lintels, timber, bricks, blocks, sand, cement etc etc) all of which could be used in ways which are unlawful and all of which could be used in ways which are unsafe.

Going to ban all those too, are you?

 

[sparkyspike]

Pick any builder's merchant or shed you like.


Going to ban all those too, are you?

I thought this was your mission?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

40 years experience in engineering and in-formal risk assessment
leads me to believe that anything that can reduce risk is worth doing even if it only results in a minor reduction in the risk.

Informal is right.

So informal, in fact, that in the space of 40 years you've not managed to learn a single thing about cost-benefit analysis.

 

[JonoPashley]

Simply answer is Part P didnt go far enough, Certain electrical items should be totally restricted from none qualified persons purchasing.

Pick any builder's merchant or shed you like.

Go down there, and you'll find you can buy all manner of items and materials (gas boilers, gas fires, WCs, windows, RSJs, lintels, timber, bricks, blocks, sand, cement etc etc) all of which could be used in ways which are unlawful and all of which could be used in ways which are unsafe.

Going to ban all those too, are you?

OK how do you propose that legislation will work when people can just go out and buy whatever they please? Some places already restrict gas fittings to CORGI registered only. Then again everything is doomed to fail while the nations BCO continue to make the rules up as they go along most dont have a clue what they are required to do round here

 

[harrisonline]

Went to B & Q yesterday. They have CU's on special offer at the end of the isle to catch customers eyes! The largest percentage of who are not electricians.

Most electricians probably get thier CU's elswhere and would go straight to the electrical isle if they needed something. They are clearly there to intice Joe public.

 

[kevindgas]

Went to B & Q yesterday. They have CU's on special offer at the end of the isle to catch customers eyes! The largest percentage of who are not electricians.

Most electricians probably get thier CU's elswhere and would go straight to the electrical isle if they needed something. They are clearly there to intice Joe public.

yes and they are probably 16th edition boards! no 30Ma RCD's
great if you want spare MCB's though!!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

OK how do you propose that legislation will work when people can just go out and buy whatever they please?

People can go and buy cars without having to prove that they have a driving licence and insurance - how do you propose that legislation forbidding people to drive without these will work when they can just go out and buy what they like?

Some places already restrict gas fittings to CORGI registered only.

That's their choice.

Unless you want more people to die, don't call for tighter legal restrictions on the sale of electrical items.

 

[JonoPashley]

Then again everything is doomed to fail while the nations BCO continue to make the rules up as they go along most dont have a clue what they are required to do round here

Did you not bother to read this part?

You can use pretty much anything in an unsafe way, and the things that are banned/restricted can be purchased with a little digging around.

On further thinking what is really needed is more readily information for homeowners. Perhaps a information pack to every home in england and wales, signs in diy sheds and Insurers clearly stating that home cover is invalid if notifyable works are illegally carried out.

Thank you for your input BAS i now see a education is more what the public need than more bans and legislation.

 

[chapeau]

Interestingly, there are signs in my local B&Q which point out that if a householder does certain work then he needs to notify building control first.

The main reason, imo, that householders do their own DIY is the expense and unreliability of electricians.

 

[LiamPope]

Some electricians. Generally not the ones on here, who are all fine and upstanding proffessionals in my experience.

 

[chapeau]

I think you are probably correct there LiamPope, there are some smart cookies on this forum. but you still get disagreements amongst the electricians, so they cannot all be right.

 

[LiamPope]

That's at least in part because good old BS7671 (like most other BS docs I've had the pleasue of reading) is occasionally sufficiently vague that it requires interpretation, which often differs from person to person. I often view asking a question on here more as taking a poll - I dont expect there to always be a definitive right answer . I'll then use the generously (or sometimes condescendingly) given opinions of all the experienced folk on here to assist me in making my own decision!

Liam

 

[hairyben]

To be fair only a joker quote's what he'd charge for a CU and what a cert will cost on top. Customers want to know what the job will cost; My quoted price for a CU change includes cert, notification, any earth bonding, and limited fault finding/rectification. The only cost on top will be if significant faults are present, and any spark worth his salt can quickly assess an install and warn a customer there may be trouble ahead. The price also seems high; my rates for a 7 way full RCBO unit to the above spec would be around £600inc (difficult bonding and parking may add) and thats in the middle of london, in outlying areas you'll get it done cheaper.

As for part P it goes both too far and not far enough, because while the idea or regulation was much needed, it's worthless when nobodies willing to enforce it. It just becomes a tax on those complying and a competitive edge for those who don't bother.

People can go and buy cars without having to prove that they have a driving licence and insurance - how do you propose that legislation forbidding people to drive without these will work when they can just go out and buy what they like?

Bad analogy, you've not bought a car recently? I had to prove licence/insurance and I gather it's the norm.

 

[ColJack]

you have to have a TV license now to BUY a TV...

my Dad got one the other day and they asked him for the house address and his name to check that the house had a license.. and this was ARGOS...!!!?