Heating and hot water not working

[paulmerton]

As it's starting to get colder, I decided to test my central heating this weekend. Unfortunately it didn't work, and now the hot water has also stopped working!

I have an Ideal FF260 boiler downstairs, which leads upstairs to an electric pump. The pump feeds to a British Gas MV22M three-way value (which I presume diverts between the hot water tank and radiators).

When I turned on the heating for the first time, the first radiator started to warm up, but that was it. Nothing else warmed up and that radiator soon started to cool down. The boiler (Ideal FF260) stops burning after less than a minute and the pipes either side of the pump are then cold - however, the pump itself gets very hot (too hot to touch for more than a second!). Is that normal?

I've taken the big screw off the front of the pump while it was running and poked a screwdriver in. Judging by the noise it made, something is definitely turning. Adjusting the speed of the pump (1-3) definitely does something.

The radiators use microbore pipes. Both of the tanks in the loft have water in them. The smaller tank has some pale brown sediment in it. The main thermostat is set to maximum. The hot water was working fine until I tried to test the heating, but now that has stopped working too.

Currently, trying to turn on either the hot water or the central heating results in the boiler firing up but shutting down after 30-60 seconds. The pump continues running and gets very hot, even though the pipes either side of it are relatively rather cold. The pump stops when I turn off the heating/hot water.

Does anyone know where the problem may lie? I'm not really an expert at any of this, so please excuse me if I've missed out any useful details. [/i]

 

[Agile]

First check the F&E tank in the loft etc.

It may have run dry.

Tony

 

[paulmerton]

First check the F&E tank in the loft etc.

It may have run dry.

Tony

Both tanks in the loft have water in them. The smaller one is the expansion tank, I believe, and the water level is above the exit pipe.

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Really need to ascertain firstly you have enough water in the system. Tank being full does not always guarantee this, cold feed could be blocked. Could you drain some water off from a drain point on a rad and observe if the level in the small tank drops to replace it?

 

[paulmerton]

Really need to ascertain firstly you have enough water in the system. Tank being full does not always guarantee this, cold feed could be blocked. Could you drain some water off from a drain point on a rad and observe if the level in the small tank drops to replace it?

Should I do that while the heating is on or off?

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Off.

Leave boiler switched off until you ascertain there is sufficient water in system. Insufficient water in the boiler is dangerous, at best new boiler, at worst a new wall where fitted......

I would suggest you drain a few gallons off, if F+E tank (smaller of the two) refills system as it should then we can look again at your problem. You may need to bleed radiators though after system has settled on refilling.

 

[paulmerton]

I'm confused now, as the central heating suddenly started working when I tested it this morning, successfully heating every radiator in the house. Then I turned on the hot water for a bit and that started to warm up. I turned them off around midday as it was getting quite warm indoors. I bled one radiator which always seems to get a lot of air in it.

And now... nothing works again. The pipes either side of the pump are cold, and after about ten minutes, the pump gets very hot (too hot to touch). The boiler only fires up occasionally (presumably because there is little or no water flow?)

Judging by the dates on various stickers, I think it's possible that the entire system hasn't been serviced for around 10 years (long before I moved it), so perhaps something is just blocked up? But then I wonder how it managed to work this morning...

Anyone got any idea what the problem could be now? I would feel safer having a rough idea of what could be wrong before I get a plumber in to fix things that may not need fixing.

 

[doitall]

Is the pump running or only sometimes.

Do you have any motorized valves and what type. It could be the actuator is sticking.

 

[paulmerton]

Is the pump running or only sometimes.

Do you have any motorized valves and what type. It could be the actuator is sticking.

The pump runs constantly whenever the heating or hot water is turned on.

The only valve I am aware of is the aforementioned British Gas MV22M, but I can't seem to find any information about that model and I'm not entirely sure how to check whether it works. If anything needs to be taken apart, I'd prefer to leave that to a plumber

 

[doitall]

Is there high level vent, maybe on the side of the cylinder to let any air out.

 

[paulmerton]

Is there high level vent, maybe on the side of the cylinder to let any air out.

Pardon my ignorance, but what might that look like? The only thing that looks like it might let something out is attached to a pipe that comes out the bottom of the hot water tank.

 

[seco services]

thats a draincock

 

[paulmerton]

thats a draincock

Ah, ok

There is also a similar looking vent attached to one of the pipes coming out the top of my boiler. Is that for letting out air? As it's downstairs, I would guess not!

 

[seco services]

that'll be a draincock to.

 

[paulmerton]

that'll be a draincock to.

Okay, that makes sense. I'm not sure how else I can let air out of the system then, other than via the radiators