Hive active heating and hot water- what is replaced

[droche]

Hello, I have finally been persuaded by the Missus to replace our heating controls with Hive. I know we need the 2 channel version but just wondered which wires the hive will be connected to. We have British gas wireless thermostat (RC1) that sends signal to receiver (WR1) and is programmed by controller (UP1). Am I right in thinking the receiver (WR1) will be replaced by the hive receiver and the controller (UP1) can be removed altogether because hive will be controlled by the thermostat ? Just trying to find out so I can buy some wire beforehand and install it in a more suitable place rather than where BG put it.
Thanks

 

[stem]

The Dual Channel Hive receiver is for systems with central heating and stored hot water (ie a hot water cylinder)

The Dual Channel Hive receiver replaces the existing dual channel programmer (UP1) Lucky you the wiring connections are the same

UP1

Hive

The the old thermostat receiver (WR1) is disconnected and removed as it is no longer required. Then a 'bridge wire' is inserted where the wires that went to its terminals 1 and 3 have been removed from so that they are electrically connected. This completes the circuit.

You can't install the Hive receiver where the existing thermostat receiver is located as you suggest, because there aren't any wires there that control the hot water side of things.

 

[ericmark]

Step one, before you buy anything, is the existing system 230 volt control, as Hive duel channel, can only work with 230 volt control. Hive is also not opentherm, although to be far the method they use gets around the problem.

The Hive TRV sends a signal to the Hive wall thermostat to tell it to run for ½ hour if it needs heat, so the wall thermostat is more like a hub than thermostat, however this of course only going to work if you have Hive TRV heads.

So yes Hive replaces the UP1 and you retain your tank thermostat but not your wall thermostat.

We have plans, W, S, Y, C sure there is another, and the C Plan has been upgraded over the years, because Hive does not allow you access to the com terminal it is internally connected to line, it will not work on the very early C Plan without a tank thermostat.

The main question is why Hive? I think using the Hive TRV heads it is very good, but without those heads, it is rather a half hearted system, Nest is a little better, but again since Nest don't as yet market their own TRV heads, again not really a complete system, EvoHome is better but you again must use their TRV heads, actually heads and wall thermostat EvoHome can work out cheaper, there is Tado which I know very little about.

So in mothers house I had a problem with sun on the bay windows, the standard wax TRV head was too slow, I bought MiHome Energenie TRV heads with the idea of latter adding Nest wall thermostat, but found it worked A1 with the old dial thermostat so never got around to fitting Nest.

At that time the Hive TRV head was not sold, if what I read is correct, the Hive TRV head will work as stand alone, so maybe best option is Hive TRV head first, then add Hive wall thermostat. As yet not talked to anyone with full Hive system, the theory is great, however so was the theory of how Nest worked, until I moved house and found Nest has removed their support for MiHome so they no longer work together. However reason for Nest was two wires between the thermostat and the heat link was all that was required to keep Nest thermostat charged and send both DHW and CH commands to heat link, and it would also work with old C Plan.

Whole idea of geofencing can be done with electronic TRV heads, don't need special wall thermostat, and programming each room independently only needs a cheap £10 electronic head, also non modulating boilers work very different to modulating, so start by saying what you want it to do. And what boiler.

Big plus swapping TRV heads to electronic type which can be programmed is no wiring to do, really simple to fit, and if your going to DIY the time of year to change is not now, if you make a mistake with wiring then no central heating, better this time of year start with TRV heads, then sure of not ending up cold.

 

[droche]

Hi, thanks for your replies. I'm glad it's the controller that is replaced because that is in a sensible place unlike the receiver where I have to dismantle a cupboard to get to it. Thanks Stem that sounds easy enough. I didn't mention it is a pumped system with a cylinder.The bridge wire will go in the junction box where all the wires meet. I remember seeing some bridge wires already there so I just add 1 to 3 ? Ericmark it is 240v on a 3amp spur and not installing any fancy radiator valves at the moment, although if the wife hears about them that could change.Thanks again.

 

[stem]

I remember seeing some bridge wires already there so I just add 1 to 3 ?

That's the number of the terminals at the thermostat receiver (WR1). You have to find the other end of the cable (ie its origin), and when you remove the wires that go to (1) and (3) the bridge goes to where those wires have been removed from.

Alternatively, if you are happy to leave the old thermostat receiver in place, you could simply move the wire from (1) and put it in (3) with the wire that is already there. Electrically it achieves the same thing.

I didn't mention it is a pumped system with a cylinder

That's fine, all you are doing is swapping a couple of simple on / off switches for an identical couple of on / off switches. From an electrical point of view you aren't actually changing anything.

 

[droche]

Just got the Hive today from Screw Fix after being messed about by Amazon and their fake black Friday deals I've wired it in like you said stem and so far it's working perfectly. Thanks a lot for your help it was really appreciated.

 

[Harbs]

I wonder if someone can help please. I would like to ask if Hive active dual channel (hot water and heating) can be used just for two heating channels instead of hot water? I have combi boiler and it produce hot water on demand so no need for hot water channel. However I want to use that 2nd channel for my two zone heating system, which would be cheaper than buying extra multi zone receiver.

 

[Mottie]

I wonder if someone can help please. I would like to ask if Hive active dual channel (hot water and heating) can be used just for two heating channels instead of hot water? I have combi boiler and it produce hot water on demand so no need for hot water channel. However I want to use that 2nd channel for my two zone heating system, which would be cheaper than buying extra multi zone receiver.

Probably not. With the heating channel, apart from setting the times, you also set the heating temperature. Also, on 'boost' for the heating, you set the 'boost' temperature. The hot water side of things is just on or off - the tank thermostat controls the temperature. You may be able to wire a thermostat in for your second zone I suppose. Sod it, I don’t know is the answer…..

 

[Harbs]

Thanks for your prompt reply. Is it possible to add 2nd thermostat ?

 

[Mottie]

I suppose you must have to have a second thermostat if you have a second zone but if you’ve got to hard wire it instead of using wireless, I’d imagine it would cost as much as just getting the right kit in the first place. Perhaps one of the heating engineers on here will offer some advice.

 

[Harbs]

Thanks Mottie

 

[stem]

@Mottie is spot on. For two heating zones you need the Multizone Heating Kit. You can find details of it here. There will be two Hive thermostats and two receivers, but they share the same hub.

 

[Harbs]

Thank you