How close to a party wall can I put RSJ?

[Tornado123]

I am putting an extension on the back of my semi, close to the party wall which divides me from next door. The opening at the back for the extension will need an RSJ.

How close to the party wall can I put the RSJ without getting the neighbours approval? If I leave 450mm of wall, this would mean 300mm for the RSJ to fit on and leave 150mm between the steel and the Party wall…is this OK?

 

[Tigercubrider]

I understood that all party wall work requires an agreement?
Also, you need to use your brickwork and some additional brickwork on your side as support?

 

[Tornado123]

I understood that all party wall work requires an agreement?
Also, you need to use your brickwork and some additional brickwork on your side as support?

Yeh I don’t think you have fully understood. The RSJ won’t be going on the party wall…If allowed I would have 450mm of my brickwork coming out from the party wall…300mm of that would hold the RSJ then 150mm would be a gap between the RSJ and the party wall.

just making sure that this would be allowed without a party wall agreement.

 

[jacko555]

I would have 450mm of my brickwork coming out from the party wall

Wouldn't this require the pwa?

 

[Tornado123]

Wouldn't this require the pwa?

it’s just original brickwork which is there now. This post is about the opening I will be putting in my back wall. So 450mm in to the wall, I would make the opening.

 

[^woody^]

Why would you intentionally want a god awfull nib if you didn't have to?

You don't need 300mm for a beam to sit on, BTW.

 

[Tornado123]

Why would you intentionally want a god awfull nib if you didn't have to?

You don't need 300mm for a beam to sit on, BTW.

My structural engineer has told me to use 300mm for the beams to sit on.
Understand your point about the nib but unfortunately getting a party wall agreement in place isn’t an option.

 

[Bouy]

.

 

[^woody^]

My structural engineer has told me to use 300mm for the beams to sit on.
Understand your point about the nib but unfortunately getting a party wall agreement in place isn’t an option.

300mm is odd, even if you're opening up the whole back of the house.

I can't understand why you think that getting an agreement is not an option, when a PW Award is always possible - do you mean that you don't want to serve notice?

Anyway, cutting this projecting wall may well come under section 2 of the Act.

 

[tony1851]

Even with a 450 nib, some of the load from the beam will end up in the party wall itself.
In which case a PWA agreemeent would be necessary. It may also be the case that the foundation of your extension is lower than the neighbour's foundation, again a matter coming under the PWA.

 

[Dereekoo]

Even with a 450 nib, some of the load from the beam will end up in the party wall itself.
In which case a PWA agreemeent would be necessary. It may also be the case that the foundation of your extension is lower than the neighbour's foundation, again a matter coming under the PWA.

Only that part of the wall that does the partioning is a party wall, walls either side of it are not party walls

 

[^woody^]

Only that part of the wall that does the partioning is a party wall, walls either side of it are not party walls

But they are projections, and potentially covered by the Act.

 

[Dereekoo]

But they are projections, and potentially covered by the Act.

Possibly, but can't find a definitive answer anywhere on that, a bit like when you make dining room/lounge into one room when does the wall become a nib, If I was the OP and from a structural point of view he is happy with whats proposed I would forget the hassle of party wall notification and crack on ( hopefully not crack the wall)

 

[tony1851]

Possibly, but can't find a definitive answer anywhere on that, a bit like when you make dining room/lounge into one room when does the wall become a nib, If I was the OP and from a structural point of view he is happy with whats proposed I would forget the hassle of party wall notification and crack on ( hopefully not crack the wall)

I think the inference from the Act is that if any additional load is put onto the p/wall, then it is subject to the Act. Putting a beam on a short nib near the wall is likely to put additional load into the wall due to the bonding effect of the brickwork, but where to draw the line with the length of nib?
In practice, the neighbour is unlikely to realize that a short nib will increase loading on the wall, so as you say best to save £££s on PWA surveyors fees and crack on.