The problem is when certain countries break the law they aren't held to account...
And they then feel they have carte blanche to do what they like...
ICJ ruling orders Israel to....
- Thread starter JohnD
- Start date
And they then feel they have carte blanche to do what they like...
Sponsored Links
Since you swerved my question, I'll assume you're okay with Israeli retribution for the attack and over 30,000 Palestinian civilians paying the price for Netanyahu's Biblical bloodlust.
- Joined
- 30 Dec 2021
- Messages
- 10,593
- Reaction score
- 1,734
- Country
It is wrong. But war is war and civilians get killed.
I don't like it but that's the war Hamas started.
Sponsored Links
- Joined
- 30 Dec 2021
- Messages
- 10,593
- Reaction score
- 1,734
- Country
That's as far as John Goes back. That's when it all starts
30,000m Palestinian civilians?, give yer head a shake Odds. Israel's estimate of combatants neutralised was 15k a couple of weeks ago. Plenty of articles about how much the Palestinian figures for fatalities have been over egged. If, being generous, we accept Palestinian figures allowing for a 10% exaggeration, that means about 15K civilians killed.
And that equates to a lower civilian to combatant rate than Kosovo and Iraq in which UK, USA and NATO fought (Kosovo anyway).
The toll in the Syrian civil war was higher again by a factor of ten.
If other countries in the UN hold Israel to account for a supposed genocide, they need to be held to account for the same offences based on the same standards they're holding Israel to account. Iraq, Kosovo and Syria need to be re-examined on the same basis and charges brought against them.
If other countries accuse Israel of Racism and Apartheid, those same countries need to be held to account and forced to explain how they are less apartheid or less racist.
If you go back to the first thread posted by Charlie George; 'Israel under Attack' you'll find plenty of comments i made on the Oct 7th attacks. Since then i've provided context between current events and history in the region to show those attacks didn't happen in isolation, which is what you're trying to do. It isn't a numbers game. It's plain as a pikestaff the Zionist government has lost control of the PR and even if the IDF manage to liquidate every Hamas battalion left in Gaza it won't change the growing world opinion that none of this will make peace between Arab and Jew any easier after the fighting stops.
The title of this thread in many ways goes back to the 6 day war in 1967 which left the Gaza Strip and the West Bank annexed plus some boarder disputes due to captured land. The boarder disputes are ignored by most other counties other than the ones that have been effected.
The annexation is illegal and also puts a number of constraints and requirement on the occupying country.I'll just stick to settlers but there are a number of other factors.
Gaza Strip easy
In 2005, all 21 settlements in the Gaza Strip and four in the northern West Bank were forcibly evacuated as part of Israeli disengagement from the Gaza Strip, known to some in Israel as "the Expulsion".[32] However, the disengagement was more than compensated by transfers to the West Bank.[82]
en.wikipedia.org
Worth a read on the settler aspect in general. More could be added about 2005.
These settlements are illegal. Anything permanent is as well eg walls. The international community could have prevented them right from the start but didn't. Israel was just allowed to carry on and their gov actively encouraged them. Settlements involve land grabs from the indigenous people. The reasons for the international laws being as they are probably goes back to German expansionism ideas. What they aimed but failed to do and similar actions by other countries.
Prior to the 7th getting permission for a settlement took some time. They had continued to build up anyway. Since the 7th the Israeli gov has fast tracked them. Some serious additional numbers. They have always been able to pick and choose on that aspect.
Benjamin has stated that he is proud to have prevented the chance of any Palestinian state forming. This area is very likely to figure. No one will force us out of the West Bank. Some factions would like to settle the strip again.
Where does genocide fit in?. Long term effects that tend to have a detrimental effect on a populations way of life. Apartheid figures in this as well. Also history.
The annexation is illegal and also puts a number of constraints and requirement on the occupying country.I'll just stick to settlers but there are a number of other factors.
Gaza Strip easy
In 2005, all 21 settlements in the Gaza Strip and four in the northern West Bank were forcibly evacuated as part of Israeli disengagement from the Gaza Strip, known to some in Israel as "the Expulsion".[32] However, the disengagement was more than compensated by transfers to the West Bank.[82]
Israeli settlement - Wikipedia
These settlements are illegal. Anything permanent is as well eg walls. The international community could have prevented them right from the start but didn't. Israel was just allowed to carry on and their gov actively encouraged them. Settlements involve land grabs from the indigenous people. The reasons for the international laws being as they are probably goes back to German expansionism ideas. What they aimed but failed to do and similar actions by other countries.
Prior to the 7th getting permission for a settlement took some time. They had continued to build up anyway. Since the 7th the Israeli gov has fast tracked them. Some serious additional numbers. They have always been able to pick and choose on that aspect.
Benjamin has stated that he is proud to have prevented the chance of any Palestinian state forming. This area is very likely to figure. No one will force us out of the West Bank. Some factions would like to settle the strip again.
Where does genocide fit in?. Long term effects that tend to have a detrimental effect on a populations way of life. Apartheid figures in this as well. Also history.
Dec 2023 comments from Israel
A senior Israeli official told journalists on Monday that around a third of those killed in Gaza so far were enemy combatants, estimating their number at less than 10,000 but more than 5,000, without detailing how the estimate was reached. The official said the total count of some 15,000 dead as of Monday given by Palestinian authorities, who do not break down the count between civilians and combatants, is "more or less" right.
A 5 to 10 thousand is a pretty amazing thing to admit.
The US defence sec has also upped his numbers. They may just be based on damage surveys.
I'm disappointed Filly. As factors crop up your now scraping the barrel.
No Justice. No peace.
A two-state solution is the only way forward.
Oh dear - have the Palestinians given up on their stated aims then? Has The Iran / Iraq / Qatar situation been resolved where they accept Israels right to exist and the Jews should not be slaughtered? But hang on its all the Jews fault.
John don't worry you have been shown many times before.
John don't worry you have been shown many times before.
Israel has never been more isolated. The president of the United States, which for decades has been Israel’s genuinely indispensable ally, is so “outraged” – his word – at Israel’s killing of those aid workers that on Thursday night he issued a barely veiled ultimatum to the country’s prime minister: do as I say or there will be no more arms. The threat is hardly empty: other western allies have already cut off weapons supplies or are considering it.
Those governments are responding to a global mood they can no longer ignore. Because it’s not Israel’s perennial critics who are denouncing the country; it’s Israel’s friends. In Britain, the WCK killings saw Lord Ricketts, a former UK national security adviser who earlier served Tony Blair, demand a suspension of arms sales. His call was echoed throughout the Conservative party,* in a letter from hundreds of lawyers, including several former justices of the supreme court, and by usually pro-Israel, right-leaning voices in the media.
*except for those living in Boris-world, who prefer to blame 'lefty lawyers'
Those governments are responding to a global mood they can no longer ignore. Because it’s not Israel’s perennial critics who are denouncing the country; it’s Israel’s friends. In Britain, the WCK killings saw Lord Ricketts, a former UK national security adviser who earlier served Tony Blair, demand a suspension of arms sales. His call was echoed throughout the Conservative party,* in a letter from hundreds of lawyers, including several former justices of the supreme court, and by usually pro-Israel, right-leaning voices in the media.
*except for those living in Boris-world, who prefer to blame 'lefty lawyers'
Sponsored Links
