Ideal ICOS Condensing Boiler - Hot Water/No Heating?

[tigers999]

Hiya,

I will start by saying hello (my first post of no doubt many more ) and I am useless with anything to do with DIY, probably a good idea I found this website lol

I currently have a problem with our boiler and I just dont understand it

We moved into a new house last year which is fitted with an Ideal Standard ICOS condensing boiler (HE12, HE15, HE18, HE24 - Not sure which model) Our old house had a Combi Boiler which was pretty straight forward to use. It had a knob which you twisted to either Hot Water, Central Heating or Both.

If cold water was coming out of the hot taps or the central heating wasnt working I would go and check the boiler and if the pilot light wasnt on I would try and ignite it and if it wouldnt ignite I would ring British Gas who would replace any part which needed replacing!

However this new boiler is just ridiculous Today as I went to run a bath (I have an illness which means I spend alot of time in the bath as it eases my symptoms which is why I am posting for advice) I managed to get an almost full bath of hot water and then it went cold!

After I got out of the bath I went downstairs to check the boiler (boiler is in kitchen, and that big cylinder thing is in a cupboard upstairs) and the boiler had F and L flashing. Now looking in the instructions it says F and L flashing means that the boiler has not lit after 3 attempts!

So fair comment, the boiler has gone out and will not re-light therefore no hot water! However, this isnt the case!

I went upstairs and checked the Cylinder (Tribune HE) and the power supply switch was turned off I assumed my wife had knocked it off so I turned it back on and went downstairs to reset the boiler.

I reset the boiler and the F and L light came back on again indicating the boiler would not light. So I thought I would try the hot water tap and low and behold I have Hot Water

The actual "Burner" LED light on the front of the Boiler is lit (indicating it is lit I assume) but the front display is showing the F and L error

So I then assumed it must be a faulty error warning but decided to check the Central Heating just to be sure! Anyway, the central heating doesnt work! When I switch the thermostat on, it doesnt even start the boiler up I assume this is because the boiler is in "lockdown" according to the manual due to the F and L error

The troubleshooting for this problem is stupid! It asks you whether your boiler is staying lit or going out I cant even see if it is or not? Its the error message telling me its not lit! Other than that I would say it is lit, otherwise how would the hot water be working?

Sorry to be so indepth with this problem but the way I see it is the more information you have the better chance of getting an answer

I will be ringing the plumber up but I am worried about the Hot Water situation. As I said I need baths to ease symptoms and I need to make plans if it is the boiler that is broken. However it could be something simple which I could do now without having to ring a plumber up!

Thanks in advance for any help and advice you can offer. I dont understand how I can have hot water but no heating and the boiler saying it isnt lit If it isnt lit, how does it heat the water?

 

[tigers999]

I thought I better add, I dont want a technical answer as such.

Just a "yeah get the plumber out" or a "sounds like an easy solution" answer would be great.

I am just concerned that I should maybe turn my boiler off completely until it is fixed or if I am ok to leave it on for the hot water?

To be honest I am insured so any work that needs doing will be done so that isnt a problem. I just want a peace of mind knowing my boiler isnt going to set on fire or something! It has made some very strange loud noises over the last couple of days

It is either a system or a conventional condensing boiler and neither should heat the water up without the boiler being lit should it?

Thanks again

 

[the.ideal.man]

first of all, hello. im from ideal as an engineer. have you tried resetting the boiler? there is a reset in the middle of the user controls. then if its been reset and still going to lockout then check that theres is gas to the house, ie. check gas hob or other appliance works. then if when the boiler is trying to fire can you hear like a bubbling sound inside the boiler? if then still no ignition and LF keep coming back, then chances are possible faulty spark generator or electrode, if the boiler fires then goes out then possible flame detection probe or lead, either way if your not corgi registered and have no knowledge in boilers or gas safety then its best to call out an heating engineer. gas valves are not a very common fault on our boilers but that not to say they dont fail. how old is the boiler?

 

[tigers999]

the.ideal.man your a star mate, thankyou for your reply

In answer to your questions we moved into a new Barratt house about 18 months ago and the boiler was fitted a few months before so it is no older than 2 years!

I have tried the re-set button on several occasions but to no avail unfortunately I can hear the bubbling you mention (I think) along with the 3 attempts the boiler makes at igniting before the F L error message appears again.

I am worried about the hot water more than the central heating at the moment to be honest. I can cope without the central heating for a week or however long it takes Barratts to send their plumber but the hot water situation is a different matter.

Is it safe to leave the boiler on? Or should I turn it off until the plumber/heating engineer comes out?

If I turn it off will it effect my hot water supply?

Thanks again for your response mate, it is truelly appreciated.

I would never attempt to fix the boiler myself. I can barely put shelves up lol. I will ring Barratts tomorrow and get them to send out their people.

Like I said, I am just worried about the Hot Water situation

Cheers

EDIT - I forgot to mention, the gas supply to the house is fine as far as I am aware! We only have the Heating and the hob which is gas and the hob is working fine

 

[kevindgas]

first of all can you heat water via an immersion element in the cylinder? this may get you out of trouble whilst you sort out boiler as the ideal man says this is normally a reset. if it continually faults to L/F then it sounds like an engineer is needed.

 

[gas4you]

Firstly if it is less than 2 years old Barratt are responsible under the warranty.

Have you an immersion heater back up fitted for your hot water, if so turn this on for now,

Are you sure you have pressed the reset button in fully? Sometimes on these you can think you have but the button has not been pushed in far enough.

Call Barrett customer care first thing tomorrow and ask for a warranty call. They will probably ask if you have proof of it being serviced after year 1 though.

 

[tigers999]

Fantastic, thanks again.

Its starting to make abit more sense now

The switch which I turned on earlier (the one I thought my wife might have knocked or something next to the cylinder) must be the immersion heater back up for the hot water, hence why we have hot water and no heating

I didnt realise we had a back up immersion heater That is quite good really

I again apologise for my complete lack of knowledge in this area. I do really appreciate your replies They on top of the research about condensing boilers I have done tonight have atleast helped me realise what my heating/water system is and how it is supposed to work! (I maybe should have read up on this when I moved in )

Anyway, now I know I am safe with Hot Water for the next couple of days I can relax! I will ring Barratts in the morning and get them to come out because I am 100% sure I am resetting the system properly but L R is still appearing. I know what you mean about not pressing it down far enough but I have done on maybe 5-8 occasions now

About 30 minutes ago I looked at the boiler and instead of L R it just had 0 (I didnt touch anything, just left it after the last reset) which means no heat is being requested. I then turned the thermostat up for the central heating and the boiler then tried to light but it came up with the L R message again.

Atleast I know it is for want of a better word "broken" and like I said I will ring Barratts up first thing.

Just one last thing, should I turn my boiler off? If it isnt working there doesnt seem any point in it being on or will it actually effect the back up immersion heater?

Thanks again

 

[gas4you]

On or off, doesn't matter no danger, will not affect the immersion heater.

 

[tigers999]

Thanks mate.

Top site, top members

 

[sydenham]

Hi Paul
if you have the chance, I would be really grateful if you could explain what you did to clear the waste trap.
Could you explain which part you disconnected and how you flushed the trap out?
I would appreciate any advice you could offer!
Many thanks,
Beth

 

[PlumbingLuddite]

A google search found this page when searching for "ICOS boiler flashing F L".

It's Christmas Eve, it's freezing and we noticed our heating was out. I went to the garage where the boiler is (an ICOS HE15) and it too had the flashing F L sequence. No amount of resets would fix it. Bubbling noise on attempts to reset. Always went back to flashing F L.

I read about the condensate trap above. Hmmm, maybe that's it I thought, Christmas Eve plumbing rates being estimated. Went back out - pondered where the condensate trap might be. Considered that it might be the white plastic pipe coming out the bottom so gave it a speculative knock ahead of pulling it to pieces. Hear some gurgling. Whacked it a bit more (gently) and heard a whole lot of ice move about and tumble down; it's been sub zero for days. Kept doing it until it sounded like it had all moved away and hit reset again. Worked like a charm. Boiler started up, displayed C and the heating is back on. Pointed a heater at the bottom of the pipe for a little while to help get rid of the ice too. I'll switch that off later.

Thanks guys. Large Christmas Eve emergency plumber bill averted. I registered here just to make this post so one day, others may benefit from it, like I did.

What did one do before the internet?

 

[gas4you]

Any external condensate pipe should be well insulated or at least 32mm waste

 

[halfcab]

Having read plumbingluddite's explanation of what had happened, I too decided to see if the sub-zero temperatures were the cause of my boiler failure.

After a couple of kettles of warm water down the outside of the condensate pipe and some gentle tapping I went inside and reset the boiler. It fired up first time, with no problems!

With a 3 month old baby in the house and being snowed in, this forum has got me out of a bit of bother, so thank you!

Cheers,
Chris

 

[Poorincomeequalsinnovatio]

Thanks very much for the advice, same problem with isar model HE24 flashing code F L and not lighting at all. Cut the pipe half way down and thick tubes of ice hit the deck, poured boiling water directly onto the outside outlet some gurgling and hey presto, boiler fired up first time, I am so glad you posted this many thanks again. Will use self-amalgamating tape to stich the pipe back up outside

P.S do you have to re-prime or refill the condensate trap?
[/i]

 

[lazybonz]

Having read plumbingluddite's explanation of what had happened, I too decided to see if the sub-zero temperatures were the cause of my boiler failure.

After a couple of kettles of warm water down the outside of the condensate pipe and some gentle tapping I went inside and reset the boiler. It fired up first time, with no problems!

With a 3 month old baby in the house and being snowed in, this forum has got me out of a bit of bother, so thank you!

Cheers,
Chris

I've just hadthe same error code flash and even after defrosting the pipe running outside it wasnt happy.... so I removed the sump trap which was actually a very simple 4 screw job....only tip is to make sure you have a bucket under the boiler to catch the water that runs out for a minute or so...

Our sump was full of grey sludge and iron fillings.. wash it through..... bang it around to diss lodge them and even blow through hard with your mouth (outside)

Re fitted the sump and hey presto.... HEAT.....HOT WATER

and not a £100 call out plus labour charge in sight