I've got a Glowworm Economy plus 60 F boiler fitted in 2001. It was o.k. at first but these last couple of years it's been noisy, with spitting and backfiring sounds. Lately I've replaced the fan and a few other bits, and yesterday I had it serviced and the whole system flushed and the pump, etc. replaced. The plumber who did the flushing was determined to find the problem as he was surprised that the flushing didn't seem to make much difference to the banging etc., so suggested I replace virtually everything which I did. He also suggested I exchange the right angled pipework in the loft for straight fitting pipes which might facilitate the boiler. This seemed to work at first and it was really quiet. The plumber left with quite a hefty cheque and we were both satisfied that the job was done. However, a few hours later, the clanging and backfiring sounds started again. All the radiators are now hot but as before there does seem to be a bit of air trapped somewhere which seems to build up. This has just cost me over £700 and it's still not working properly. The plumber hinted that it might make a difference if I were to raise the feed and expansion cistern a bit higher. He certainly was keen to find the problem but I am now at my wits end. Anybody got any ideas?
I've had everything done but still have a noisy boiler!
- Thread starter stevgillamos
- Start date
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You need to describe the feed and vent pipework arrangements - where do these pipes connect to the circulating pipes, height of feed tank, controls (motorised valves) on the pipework. A diagram or picture would help. I would suspect air being drawn in.
Also you've paid your plumber a hefty wedge to fix the problem and he hasn't. You should expect him to come back and look at it FOC. Sounds like you've paid for some unnecessary parts and work. However I can understand that you may not have much confidence in him.
Also you've paid your plumber a hefty wedge to fix the problem and he hasn't. You should expect him to come back and look at it FOC. Sounds like you've paid for some unnecessary parts and work. However I can understand that you may not have much confidence in him.
You have headed the topic "I have had everything done".
Clearly you have not had the one thing that is actually required done!
Perhaps your "plumber" was more interested in doing a lot of paid work for you rather that actually fixing the problem?
In my view they should not do anything unless they can guarantee that it is actually required and accept the cost if it is not!
I call them parts changers!
Perhaps you should get a proper heating engineer to diagnose what the real fault is ( on a no-fix no-fee basis ).
Tony
Clearly you have not had the one thing that is actually required done!
Perhaps your "plumber" was more interested in doing a lot of paid work for you rather that actually fixing the problem?
In my view they should not do anything unless they can guarantee that it is actually required and accept the cost if it is not!
I call them parts changers!
Perhaps you should get a proper heating engineer to diagnose what the real fault is ( on a no-fix no-fee basis ).
Tony
chrishutt said:
Hi Chrishutt, sorry for the delay in getting back and thank you for your comments. I’m not 100% sure where this is the right kind of information you need but here goes. The feed pipe connects to circulating pipes which drop down through to the bedroom airing cupboard where there is a tank (padded hot water tank) which is where the two motorised valves are (both have been replaced recently, once a year ago, the other a few days ago). From here the pipes are connected throughout the house i.e. under floorboards etc.
Recommendations in the handbook for height of feed tank/expansion cistern are 1150 mm minimum from the (? Return) pipe of the boiler. I measured my setup as being approx. 980 mm, which is probably what the plumber meant when he said raising the cistern might make a difference. However, it was ok when first fitted in 2001 so I don’t know whether this would make a great deal of difference.
The clanging noise seems to emanate from the return pipe process as I’ve noticed just after the clanking there’s a lot of steam is rising from the top of the cistern following boiling hot water splashing into it. Is this normal? I’ve also noticed that when I turn on the large radiator in one of the bedrooms, this seems to quieten the noise noticeably i.e. as if drawing off the water from the boiler/cistern which stopped the boiling water splashing sound too. Incidentally, this radiator is the one which always contained the most air when I bled them but I don't want to leave it on all the time just to quieten the radiator. I’ve emailed the plumber and hope to get him back at some point (if he’ll come). If you have any comments, they would be most welcome. (As I write this I've left the big radiator on and the boiler is not clanking. Might this be related to pressure or something).
Best wishes
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It always worries me when I hear about radiators being turned off. A heating system is not really designed to be used in that way. If you want less heat then turn the boiler thermostat down.
First check your pump is on setting 1 or 2. If 2 then reduce it to 1 and that will probably help. It must NOT be on 3.
It seems that your system has become partially blocked or is badly designed.
Tell us about the pump setting and then we may suggest you try to clean it with Ferroquest.
Tony
First check your pump is on setting 1 or 2. If 2 then reduce it to 1 and that will probably help. It must NOT be on 3.
It seems that your system has become partially blocked or is badly designed.
Tell us about the pump setting and then we may suggest you try to clean it with Ferroquest.
Tony
Agile said:
Hi Tony, thanks for your input. The room thermostat which is a new replacement, is like the old one i.e. on or off with no in betweens. I've had a couple of thermostat knobs fitted to the two main radiators downstairs which I should be able to turn down (but they seem to go off). The pump also is a new replacement which the plumber left on 3 (top). I asked if I should turn it down and he didn't seem to think so. It seems much quieter than the older one. Also, the whole system was flushed through so wouldn't this clean out any gunge? Earlier today, I switched the pump to 2 just after I turned on the upstairs radiator as mentioned earlier. The old pump seemed to be working o.k. but the plumber had suggested replacing it. It wasn't that old but I was desperate to try and stop the clanging from the boiler. My wife was moaning about being too hot so I had to turn everything off. (I was 'experimenting' turning radiators on and off as mentioned). I'm going to resume tomorrow and see if I can figure this out.
Steve
I turned the thermostat down on the boiler and the clanging has eased off but I still get a loud groaning/moaning noise from the boiler every time it fires up. It only stops when I turn the system off. There doesn't seem to be any air in the radiators when I loosen the valves to see. One of the upstairs radiators is a little cooler at the top but it's a radiator without a valve on it (bathroom radiator with a towel bar) so I can't let out any air. One radiator downstairs is totally cold but again there's no air in it. I've been reading other comments on this forum. Could air be getting in via the ballcock/tank mechanism and if so, how might this manifest? Should I ask the plumber to check this out as a possible source of the problem?
stevgillamos said:
Further to my attempts at silencing a noisy system, my plumber has suggested trying auto vents to get rid of the air that seems to be permanently in the system. I'm not sure as whenever I go to let out air from the rads hardly any ever seems to come out. Will these auto vents find air that I can't or is this just parts replacing as per usual?
Obviously I dont know how competent your plumber is.
Whilst AAVs would get rid of any air they would not be addressing the root cause of the problem.
This is more likely to be as a result of a blockage or poor design.
It it used to work well then it would be a blockage or something which has changed.
Just because it has been "power flushed" does not mean that it has been done properly or with the right chemicals.
Tony
Whilst AAVs would get rid of any air they would not be addressing the root cause of the problem.
This is more likely to be as a result of a blockage or poor design.
It it used to work well then it would be a blockage or something which has changed.
Just because it has been "power flushed" does not mean that it has been done properly or with the right chemicals.
Tony
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