Kitchen Woes

[Footsoldier888]

I have recently bought this house and have had quite a bit disappointment with it so far.

On my survey the kitchen was graded "2" with 1 being good and 3 replace immediately. The Surveyor found some damp in the RH back corner plus the living room and advised I get a damp survey which I did.

The damp company advised getting certain walls replastered with a sand and cement render. They also wanted to inject something into the bricks plus wanted me to pay for their worthless insurance, the whole lot added up to quite a sum so I decided against it and just had the plastering done by a different contractor.

The reason I did this was the more I was in the kitchen the more I began to realise how damp it was and it seemed unlikely to me the damp was confined to this one wall as the cupboards on the outside wall reeked of damp.

There was a laminate wood floor laid down which also smelt bad and was stained. I had an idea that there might be no damp course underneath and sure enough when I pulled it up the original hard stone floor was present.

At this point I realised the whole lot had to come out. Then it got worse as all the plaster is shot, I am currently left with this:

Untitled

• Footsoldier888
• 20 Jul 2014
• 1

Quite annoying as neither the survey nor the damp company picked up on what is quite a common thing in a house of this age (built 1927).

The original floor is pretty good condition. There was a mass of earth and salt under the sink but it seems dry enough.

The question is what to do now? The thing is this kitchen is narrow, has a boiler and two big windows but no window at the back. In short it isn't a very nice space. I was hoping to extend by removing the back wall and the outside wall but this was meant to be in two or three years time as I would need to add a room upstairs and a kitchen diner or it would not be cost effective.

If I hacked off the remaining plaster to say 1m high should I get the floor dug down and a dpc plus concrete laid? Or is there a cheaper fix to the floor that will do for a couple of years? The floor is a fair bit higher than the ground level outside, at least a brick's worth I think.

Any help appreciated!

 

[ree]

First, determine with your partner exactly what you will do (or can afford) in say two years time?

Any advice from this forum will be almost useless (and expensive) unless we can think ahead with you.

If the kitchen stays as it is then remove all the units and appliances, and lift the floor - re-lay concrete on a membrane.

Render all the walls(there seems to have been previous Damp rendering?) and insulate the ceiling.

Re-wire, re-plumb (and gas) and re-design the layout.

If you want suggestions ref an extension then post external pics of the three exterior walls, and the rear and side elevations..

 

[Footsoldier888]

How much is the approx cost of digging down and installing the concrete and membrane? Kitchen is 3.5m x 2.3m.

If I were to dig it down myself what percentage of the cost would I be looking at saving?

I like the idea of using block and beam but would that be a lot more expensive?

 

[ree]

I have no idea for the first two questions.
B&B is a bizarre idea.

You could dig out, lay the membrane and pour a slab about 50mm shy of the required finished surface. Trowel the slab to a best possible finish. Wait for a drying out period and then have a screeder come in for the last 50mm.

Or allow professionals to pour and float finish the slab at the required floor level for tile or whatever. No screeding necessary.

 

[Footsoldier888]

OK I have bumped this old thread I started because I have a question about liquid dpm.

An identical house nearby are doing a renovation, they have removed their right hand wall in the photo above to form a kitchen diner. They have removed the tiles, there is now a highly uneven 1920's concrete floor which looks dry. It is now about 5cm below the level of the floorboards in what will be the dining area.

Putting aside the lack of insulation in the concrete floor, could they pour a liquid dpm onto it and get the floors level, or is this a false economy? They have taken all the walls back to bare brick, I think we can assume the plaster was fairly damp at the lower levels. To me I would say it was because the space is now open, it is about 10m sq plus there would be the benefit of insulation.

If they go for a liquid dpm is there a real risk damp could get forced up the walls? How do you evaluate which path to take???

 

[Footsoldier888]

So if they were to go this way, as I understand it they would measure the damp level with a hygrometer and if OK grind it level and use F Ball Stopgap F77 or similar???

Is it a case of relying on the meter or making a judgement call as to the age and condition of the concrete???

 

[^woody^]

Yes they could coat it and screed it. Damp would not get forced up the walls, as it would need to be under pressure to do this and this pressure would not be there in this case. Any damp would just rise by capillarity as normal and would not be any worse if the floor was coated. Normally thought, if there is a damp issue requiring floors to be damp-proofed, then walls would be to if nothing is there already.

 

[Footsoldier888]

Thanks Woody.

Looking at this neighbour project as a way to learn, they have removed the wall and chimney breast and have a 6m by 3.5m space. Thinking in terms of best practise and quality, am I right it would be best to dig out the 8sq m tile area, fit insulation dpm etc and then replace all the joists on the other side.

On the chimney breast side it would be great to fit a sink on that wall, can the waste pipe travel 6m to meet with the existing drain on the tiled section? Or would it be better go go for a suspended floor instead of concrete and make the whole room one suspended floor, ie fit entirely new joists etc.

For the 3.5m joist span, in view of this pipe and many cables required for a kitchen, would I beams or even web joists be more appropriate? The drop from floorboard to ground is currently 57cm.

Sorry for such basic questions but I am thinking it would be all to easy to get the levels wrong without considering everything, plus this sink waste pipe.

 

[tomfe]

You always want to try and have a solid floor over a suspended floor it's cheaper, less bouncy and better thermally (with all factors being the same).
You can run duct work in the floor for cables and water pipe, though not for wastes so you'd have to have these before the floor is made up.

 

[Footsoldier888]

Yes good point, I get that. As you can see I hadn't thought about the idea of turning the whole zone into a solid floor . Good idea!

So remove the sleeper walls and as the ground is concreted at 57cm underneath would it in theory be possible to start from there, I think 60cm is the level you start at say.

This area is at the back of the house so I take it you would have to channel two pipes to connect to the airbricks, so as to keep the front rooms ventilated.

 

[tomfe]

This area is at the back of the house so I take it you would have to channel two pipes to connect to the airbricks, so as to keep the front rooms ventilated.

This would be ideal however you can always double up the air bricks on one side.