LED lighting circuits, dimmers and drivers advice

[gorselands]

Yes, already have under cabinet lighting that I will replace at some time with LED. Thanks for the contribution. Onwards and upwards!

Mike

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As you have already noted, using small 2" diameter torches recessed into the ceiling means you need a lot of them, as that format is not much cop at evenly lighting up rooms - their fundamental design is actually to not do that - MR16 lights came out of the retail/display market. It's not for nothing that they are commonly called spotlights.

In places like kitchens, bathrooms, WCs, possibly hallways and landings where you just want unobtrusive efficient lighting that just gets on and does the job, there's a lot to be said for this type of light:



If you want LED, again go for larger sizes, e.g. the Thorn BaseLED.

http://www.thornlighting.co.uk/download/Base_LED_Brochure.pdf

http://www.thornlighting.co.uk/PDB/Ressource/teaser/E2/TLG_BaseLED.pdf

http://www.thornlighting.co.uk/object/PDF/datasheet.aspx?CompanyID=7&GroupID=12650&CL=E2&CC=GB


Fluorescent strip lights don't have to look like this:

For example the top right one here:




or these:

And these are all from one maker. Actually a few years old and probably discontinued, but there will be others around.

Fluourescent lights can be dimmed. If you find one you like which isn't dimmable, look to see how easy it would be to replace the ballast with a dimmable one (which you can often find on fleaBay).


In terms of basic technology, as well as fluorescent and LED, look into magnetic induction lamps, dielectric barrier discharge lighting (Osram have been sitting on their Planon technology for b****y years, which is a shame), and Electron stimulated luminescence.


You've got ceiling height to play with - rather than lower it you could put curves at the top of the walls and fit concealed cold-cathode neon lighting above a cornice.





Or you could have a dropped section with the same above it - here's an example of that in a domestic kitchen showing that it isn't only suitable for nightclubs and hotel foyers:

Untitled

• slup
• 31 Jan 2009
• 16

(Ignore the fact that there are also torches in there )

 

[gorselands]

WOW, that's great. And thanks for all the pictures and links. It will take me a while to go through them all and I'm presently in the middle of tiling.

Not heard of magnetic induction lamps and dielectric barrier discharge but will enjoy looking into them. Cold cathode takes me back to my photographic days. I was thinking of some form of soft strip lighting on top of the units as there is a metre or so of exposed brickwork that I want to illuminate. Only lowering the ceiling by six inches. The old one is lath and plaster and shot. I also want to insulate it as the kitchen is north facing and perishing in the winter.

The house is Edwardian and retains most of its original features and stained glass. The kitchen is a balancing act and lighting is important. I want it updated, contemporary whilst retaining some of the character of the house. Hence exposing and making a feature of the the large arched recess where the original range used to be. All good fun.

Thanks again, I do appreciate the time people spend replying and their helpfulness.

Cheers

Mike

 

[SimonH2]

I was thinking of some form of soft strip lighting on top of the units as there is a metre or so of exposed brickwork that I want to illuminate.

That sounds a good plan. A few flouro tubes would provide a good diffused light when bounced off the ceiling.

I'd be inclined to have flouro for good work light, and perhaps something else for "mood" lighting.

 

[gorselands]

The more I read, look and ponder the more ideas I have. Some of them quite fanciful. Fortunately there is no rush to get it finished.

I have three 6 x 4 windows with muslin type roller blinds that would make great projection screens. Now that could really create some mood lighting !!!

Another thought is track lighting. Too many options. The only constant is that whatever I end up with I want it to be energy efficient and I think LED is the future.

Cheers for now

Mike

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I also want to insulate it as the kitchen is north facing and perishing in the winter.

As it's a kitchen moisture levels can be high - you will need to be especially careful with the barrier layer. Any lights penetrating the ceiling will probably be a no-no.

 

[gorselands]

I don't understand what you mean by barrier layer. Many kitchens and bathrooms have lights recessed into the ceiling.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I don't understand what you mean by barrier layer.

You should probably do a bit of reading up on insulation - sites of makers like Knauf, Kingspan etc have lots of useful info.

You plan to insulate below the ceiling - you must have a vapour barrier, or warm moist air will get to the cold side and condense, whereupon mould and rot will set in.

Many kitchens and bathrooms have lights recessed into the ceiling.

And if these are providing a route for warm air to get into an unheated space, such as an insulated loft or ceiling void, then many people are risking getting a very unpleasant and expensive surprise in the future...

http://images.google.co.uk/search?q=roof+rot+condensation

 

[SimonH2]

Any lights penetrating the ceiling will probably be a no-no.

Unless they maintain the vapour seal - as some LEDs do.

 

[gorselands]

Again, thank you for the information. I think it must be difficult to have a vapour barrier that remains intact if downlights are fitted. Presumably the lamp units that come with bulb fitted are a sealed unit that prevents the vapour getting past.

Maybe spotlights/flourescent dome ceiling lights would be better as apart from the cables the ceiling will remain intact. Tiling complete, my indecision about lights is holding up the job as I need to do the cabling and get it checked before the ceiling goes up.

Mike

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I need to do the cabling and get it checked before the ceiling goes up.

And before that you need to apply for Building Regulations approval.

 

[gorselands]

Did contact the council re intended work and building regs (ceiling and electrics). As long as the electrician is Part P registered, issues me with a certificate and registers the work with his governing body when completed, building approval not required. I will end up with two certificates.

Mike

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As long as the electrician is Part P registered, issues me with a certificate and registers the work with his governing body when completed, building approval not required.

Indeed not.

But you've missed 4 incredibly important words out of that, which are "who does the work", as in

"As long as the electrician who does the work is Part P registered, issues me with a certificate and registers the work with his governing body when completed, building approval not required."


But that's not how you are proposing to get the work done:

I need to do the cabling and get it checked

It doesn't work like that.

 

[gorselands]

Thanks again. Sorry if I did not make myself clear. The electrician, who will do the work, said it would be ok for me to fit the patress and switch boxes, do the chasing and put in some of the cable runs following the prescribed safe zones. He would then check this work, install the lighting circuit and fit the sockets, switches and lights. I still need to decide on what lights and where. The information and links you sent me have been very interesting.

You're obviously knowledgeable and experienced; architect, interior designer, master builder?? And someone who doesn't like sheds!

Cheers

Mike