Newly refurbed room - damp patches

[dal3001]

Hi,

I recently had a room totally re-done. It was gutted and stripped all the way back to brick and built back out.

The plastering was completed around 4 or 5 weeks ago and the house hasn't been heated during that time. In the room, the vast majority of the plaster appears dry. On one of the external walls, there are some damp patches that have never gone away and they appear to have a kind of white residue on as well (salt?). There's also a bit of staining/damp around the plug socket that's on that wall.

I wasn't involved in the build process that much but I think the boards could have been dot and dabbed on that wall directly on to the brick. I also believe the plasterboard is the insulated type.

The builder assures me this is normal and it will dry out but I'm not so sure. Anyone seen this before? Is it the dabs wicking the water through from the brickwork? Bit disappointed if this is the case as it would have been much easier to fix when the room was a shell a few months ago...

Pictures attached showing the stains (There are more that are similar and not in the picture) and also a close-up of one. It has some pencil lines on it, doesn't seem to be getting any bigger.

Thanks

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Does your house have solid walls? If yes then dot and dab direct to brick tends to give you this problem on exterior walls by wicking water through. No idea whether any of the barrier paint type solutions will help....

 

[dal3001]

Does your house have solid walls? If yes then dot and dab direct to brick tends to give you this problem on exterior walls by wicking water through. No idea whether any of the barrier paint type solutions will help....

Yeah that's a solid brick external wall.

I'm not really sure whether to address it fully by ripping it out and starting again but seems like potentially overkill and also a bit of a waste since it was only done a few weeks ago...

Basically I'm not sure how big an issue it is and if it's worth raising with the builder.

I mean, could I just seal it with something and leave it or is that going to lead to pain later on?

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Try on the paint and decorate forum, lots of talk of magic paint on there.
Unless the room is tiny you have been naughty and breached building regs- if you take an exterior wall back to bare brick you are required to consider insulating said wall to refurb u value. 100mm of Celotex or similar would have done and prevented your wicking problem.50mm would give a significant improvement....

 

[dal3001]

Try on the paint and decorate forum, lots of talk of magic paint on there.
Unless the room is tiny you have been naughty and breached building regs- if you take an exterior wall back to bare brick you are required to consider insulating said wall to refurb u value. 100mm of Celotex or similar would have done and prevented your wicking problem.50mm would give a significant improvement....

Now you mention it, I had a conversation about this with the builder at the time and he said we'd get it sorted to building regs and he did mention the insulation. Not sure if he just did insulated plasterboard instead though... Guess that's not enough?

Would this suggest there's no insulation then? Is there any other potential reasons or is this pretty much nailed on to be dot and dab wicking water and a lack of insulation?

 

[Notch7]

Now you mention it, I had a conversation about this with the builder at the time and he said we'd get it sorted to building regs and he did mention the insulation. Not sure if he just did insulated plasterboard instead though... Guess that's not enough?

Would this suggest there's no insulation then? Is there any other potential reasons or is this pretty much nailed on to be dot and dab wicking water and a lack of insulation?

You would get no damp patches with insulated plasterboard.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

What he said. If he charged for insulation that's criminal fraud. You'll struggle to prove it unless he presented a written quote or invoice mentioning insulation or compliance with building regs

 

[tell80]

Barrier liquids or paint wont help.
From the pics: the taping & skimming are very poor.
Can you post a pic of the outside of the wall? And a pic showing the whole interior wall?
Previous to stripping were any damp signs visible?

Showing such marks so low on the wall suggests that rising damp might be involved? But a pic of the outside would provide more info. when I'll provide more on a possible solution.

 

[Nige F]

How you know marks are low ? could be penetrating damp.

 

[dal3001]

Barrier liquids or paint wont help.
From the pics: the taping & skimming are very poor.
Can you post a pic of the outside of the wall? And a pic showing the whole interior wall?
Previous to stripping were any damp signs visible?

Showing such marks so low on the wall suggests that rising damp might be involved? But a pic of the outside would provide more info. when I'll provide more on a possible solution.

I've attached the best pictures I can of the entire wall. The staining doesn't seem to be consistent near the bottom, it's more of a pattern like it's following the join on a board or something. It's noticeable around the cut out for the plug socket as well.


I included a picture of the other external wall that has the door on it as well as that also appears to be less dried out towards the bottom. I've also attached a picture of the outside. The wall in question is to the left of the Velux window and is mostly rendered. I believe it's also rendered from my neighbours side.

All of the roof including Parapet wall render, Velux, flashings etc... are brand new and were part of the same job. It had a clear plastic roof before.

I can't tell you for sure whether that wall had damp issues before as we hadn't lived in the house very long. Previously it was clad with some fake wood material. I do remembered seeing some root/vine looking vegetation in the masonry though when they took it back to brick, so would probably say it's damp.

It looks fairly sealed now from outside I would say? I did include a final pic which looks like a gap in the render where the fence post was in the way. Could explain the less dry parts near the skirting on the wall with the door.

What he said. If he charged for insulation that's criminal fraud. You'll struggle to prove it unless he presented a written quote or invoice mentioning insulation or compliance with building regs

Insulation was definitely discussed multiple times and I've actually just found an email where I responded to his initial quote asking him to include the insulation on that wall but that's as much as I have really...

 

[dal3001]

Thanks for the inputs so far by the way.

I raised the issue with our builder too this morning and he showed me some pictures of this wall as it was under construction and I can see he's used plasterboard with insulation behind. The areas of damp correspond roughly in his pictures to the areas where adhesive has been used either in corners or where the boards are joined.

He assured me that this would just take longer to dry but would eventually dry out and be fine.

Is he right?

 

[tell80]

HI,
thank you for the new pics & info. Further pics showing the wall render(?) on the neighbour's side showing from ground to parapet. And a pic showing the door wall at ground level?

NO. It will not dry out and be fine.
For example:
1. The metal skim beads on both sides of the door reveal are rusting - plastic beads should have been used.
2. There are obvious signs of damp damaged decorated surfaces. Rising damp can be seen peeping over the skirtings near the doorway.
3. Poor taping and skimming - p/board outlines are beginning to grin thro.
4. Where did you see the root/vines? Were they treated?

On the roof:
5. The parapet copings appear to be allowing moisture thro the grouting joins.
6. The LH corner of the lower parapet wall is failing.
7. The rendering in general looks very rough. The bare patch behind the fence post must also be rendered.
8. All the lead flashings that are at masonry abutments have been done incorrectly.
9. The slate flashings should be done with soakers & Separate cover flashings. Cover flashing should be chased into the masonry.
10. Incorrectly installed flashing is the cause of the high level in the room water penetration.
11. The band of mortar - a weird kind of unnecessary plinth - above the flashings should be removed.
12. google "flashing lookouts" a lookout will help where the abutment flashing meets the gutter.

To get a sound, dry, healthy room then all the latest work probably needs hacking off to masonry - your call?
And the other outside work will also need doing.

 

[dal3001]

HI,
thank you for the new pics & info. Further pics showing the wall render(?) on the neighbour's side showing from ground to parapet. And a pic showing the door wall at ground level?

NO. It will not dry out and be fine.
For example:
1. The metal skim beads on both sides of the door reveal are rusting - plastic beads should have been used.
2. There are obvious signs of damp damaged decorated surfaces. Rising damp can be seen peeping over the skirtings near the doorway.
3. Poor taping and skimming - p/board outlines are beginning to grin thro.
4. Where did you see the root/vines? Were they treated?

On the roof:
5. The parapet copings appear to be allowing moisture thro the grouting joins.
6. The LH corner of the lower parapet wall is failing.
7. The rendering in general looks very rough. The bare patch behind the fence post must also be rendered.
8. All the lead flashings that are at masonry abutments have been done incorrectly.
9. The slate flashings should be done with soakers & Separate cover flashings. Cover flashing should be chased into the masonry.
10. Incorrectly installed flashing is the cause of the high level in the room water penetration.
11. The band of mortar - a weird kind of unnecessary plinth - above the flashings should be removed.
12. google "flashing lookouts" a lookout will help where the abutment flashing meets the gutter.

To get a sound, dry, healthy room then all the latest work probably needs hacking off to masonry - your call?
And the other outside work will also need doing.

Ah man, that's a depressing read.

This outfit came with decent recommendations. I can't really afford to pay someone to hack it all back to brick. I've basically spent up getting it this far. It's impossible to pick a builder...

Are some of the materials like the flashings salvageable?

If I can keep the roof and the tiled floor and the other basic structural bits, that would be something.

 

[JohnD]

How have you been ventilating and drying the house?

If is unoccupied, open the loft hatch. Water vapour is naturally lighter than air and will rise and escape through the eaves gaps, being replaced by fresh air through airbricks and draughts.

 

[tell80]

If you post my latest request for pics it might get worse - the thing is, its useless to give easy, soft advice.
The basic thing in all remedial damp work is to find the cause, and then fix it.
The good news is the flashings are re-useable and the roof & basic structure should be OK.
The floor tiles might be fine depending on the pics & does the slab have a DPM (membrane) under the concrete?

The pics raise Q's ref the main house floors & walls but come back to that when your ready.